It is just possible that I messed up.
I seem to remember someone claiming Revelation 12 pertained to Mary. I can't find it so I must admit my problem is with me. :-(
Posted on 08/27/2010 11:45:13 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
The ultimate intention of Catholicism is the restoration of the Holy Roman Empire. That has always been the ambition, at least covertly, but now it is being promoted overtly and openly.
The purpose of this article is only to make that intention clear. It is not a criticism of Catholics or Catholicism (unless you happen to think a Catholic dictatorship is not a good thing).
The most important point is to understand that when a Catholic talks about liberty or freedom, it is not individual liberty that is meant, not the freedom to live one's life as a responsible individual with the freedom to believe as one chooses, not the freedom to pursue happiness, not the freedom to produce and keep what one has produced as their property. What Catholicism means by freedom, is freedom to be a Catholic, in obedience to the dictates of Rome.
The Intentions Made Plain
The following is from the book Revolution and Counter-Revolution:
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"B. Catholic Culture and Civilization
"Therefore, the ideal of the Counter-Revolution is to restore and promote Catholic culture and civilization. This theme would not be sufficiently enunciated if it did not contain a definition of what we understand by Catholic culture and Catholic civilization. We realize that the terms civilization and culture are used in many different senses. Obviously, it is not our intention here to take a position on a question of terminology. We limit ourselves to using these words as relatively precise labels to indicate certain realities. We are more concerned with providing a sound idea of these realities than with debating terminology.
"A soul in the state of grace possesses all virtues to a greater or lesser degree. Illuminated by faith, it has the elements to form the only true vision of the universe.
"The fundamental element of Catholic culture is the vision of the universe elaborated according to the doctrine of the Church. This culture includes not only the learning, that is, the possession of the information needed for such an elaboration, but also the analysis and coordination of this information according to Catholic doctrine. This culture is not restricted to the theological, philosophical, or scientific field, but encompasses the breadth of human knowledge; it is reflected in the arts and implies the affirmation of values that permeate all aspects of life.
"Catholic civilization is the structuring of all human relations, of all human institutions, and of the State itself according to the doctrine of the Church.
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Got that? "Catholic civilization is the structuring of all human relations, of all human institutions, and of the State itself according to the doctrine of the Church." The other name for this is called "totalitarianism," the complete rule of every aspect of life.
This book and WEB sites like that where it is found are spreading like wildfire. These people do not believe the hope of America is the restoration of the liberties the founders sought to guarantee, these people believe the only hope for America is Fatima. Really!
In Their Own Words
The following is from the site, "RealCatholicTV." It is a plain call for a "benevolent dictatorship, a Catholic monarch;" their own words. They even suggest that when the "Lord's Payer," is recited, it is just such a Catholic dictatorship that is being prayed for.
[View video in original here or on Youtube. Will not show in FR.]
Two Comments
First, in this country, freedom of speech means that anyone may express any view no matter how much anyone else disagrees with that view, or is offended by it. I totally defend that meaning of freedom of speech.
This is what Catholics believe, and quite frankly, I do not see how any consistent Catholic could disagree with it, though I suspect some may. I have no objection to their promoting those views, because it is what they believe. Quite frankly I am delighted they are expressing them openly. For one thing, it makes it much easier to understand Catholic dialog, and what they mean by the words they use.
Secondly, I think if their views were actually implemented, it would mean the end true freedom, of course, but I do not believe there is any such danger.
Give it up - follow you own posts and what YOU said, not me. Another ‘make it personal’ PC cover! Not surprised!
I think that anyone raised with a knowledge of the Ten Commandments knows that “bearing false witness” is the commandment against lying, not against accidentally telling falsehoods without culpability. The “thou shalt nots,” after all, are all about SINS, and REALLY BIG SINS at that.
There really isn't very much nuance to the phrase.
It's just used here because for now, it's one of those “finesses” that you like to talk about, to get around the Religion Forum rules.
I've seen both Catholics and non-Catholics use it. I've been surprised that it's been permitted up until now, as the meaning is pretty clear. But I don't have a dog in this fight, so to speak. I'm perfectly happy with leaving it, as because then it becomes an officially-permitted way of calling someone a liar, which I think is a good thing.
As for your example of posting claims and belief, and the use of the word "liar," I submit that your example is a straw man. Personally, I've never suggested that the word "lie" or "liar" be applied to folks over theological differences.
However, there are times when posters post actual, mundane, observable, non-theological things that turn out to be false. And when this is pointed out to them multiple times, they continue to post the untruths.
It is more reasonable to assume that such posters are telling lies and are liars than that they are grossly (IQ < 60) stupid.
Of course, alternatively, it may be that some of the posters herein are directly influenced or controlled by demons. Perhaps if we can't say folks are "lying," we could suggest that maybe they're possessed? I can think of several posters herein who seem to show signs of demonic influence.
sitetest
Yes, you’re right. My mind was still on an earlier post when someone said ‘the carpenter’s son.’ I didn’t want to take anything away from Jesus’ carpentry, even if He went off on a different career path later ;)
Sorry, bait not taken.
A number of us Proddys have similar perceptions and convictions.
LOL.
What does it mean when (I guess) grown people have nothing better to do than sit around and type “you’re a liar” “no I’m not”, and so on and sew forth
Does God’s word say you are violating the commandments by celebrating the Lord’s Day on Sunday?
I believe you bought the bait hook line and sinker before I ever posted to you!
What is that supposed to mean?
I seem to remember someone claiming Revelation 12 pertained to Mary. I can't find it so I must admit my problem is with me. :-(
Um, I hope it is clear, now anyway, that I’m asking for *your* view. Like you’ve been willing to give on what God’s word says on other questions.
Does God’s word say you are violating the commandments by celebrating the Lord’s Day on Sunday?
REGRESSION TO A 2 YEAR OLD MENTALITY/EMOTIONALITY?
LOL.
Probably it’s a symptom of a lot of things.
However, I’m grading papers . . . besides, I really don’t want to GO THERE anyway. LOL.
ahhh well . . . maybe some elaboration . . .
I’m probably called more uglies hereon than the rest combined. Certainly Dr E and I are.
MOSTLY it’s of no consequence to me. Certainly it’s of no eternal consequence to me. Often it’s more silly and absurd than anything. And it says more about the accusers than about me.
Dr E probably has had little or no RAD or else has overcome it better or more and so it’s even more water off a duck, to her.
Sometimes, a probably too human part of me gets weary of the outrageousness of the accusations or perhaps how much they get away with them and I feel a good slap-down is in order.
More of the time, I prefer to focus on something that alerts lurkers to the fact that the other idiotic perspective posted really is idiotic.
you need a scratched out bible, try St. Vincent de Paul
LOL! D-fendr isn't even a Catholic. So utterly predictable
I KNOW who I AM “IN CHRIST”! PRAISE GOD! THANK YOU, JESUS!
so what? you probably think I’m Protestant
Bottom line: all part of the same tree.
Mary is the mother of Christ, Christ is King, the Church is the Body of Christ, I think you can take the typology from there.
Now, can you answer the question of why this interpretation concerns you more than the Christian teaching of the Divinity of Christ and Jesus being the Way, the Truth and the Light?
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