Thanks for the input. I guess what I was trying to get at here was, what was the point of Mary having to be born without original sin and, subsequently, freedom from the sinful nature that perplexes us all? Knowing that God is omnipresent and ominscient, he of course sees all that will be because he is not bound by time as we know it. He is not bound by anything but his own set boundaries.
The "Immaculate Conception" of Mary was a doctrine that got tossed around for a number of centuries. Not all "Fathers of Church" agreed with the final dogmatic expression that finally came out in Ineffabilis Deus on 8 December 1854. Until then, the doctrine was not declared dogma and the Church had a freedom of sorts to accept or reject it. My whole question boils down to this, WHY? Why did Mary HAVE to be born without sin? Jesus Christ was born without sin because he was the incarnate God. He was born of a virgin (Mary) just as prophecy said he would be. He was tempted in all ways as we are, yet he was without sin. Because of his own sinless life, he could be the spotless, unblemished sacrifice for our sins. I just don't see why Mary HAS to also be sinless.
I understand the concept of the "Ark" of the covenant and the comparison with Mary. I really do get it, but I think this extra-biblical doctrine of her sinlessness is unnecessary and I can see the discord it causes even still. I respect her, I honor her, I admire her bravery and her faith - no one who is a genuine Christian doesn't. I think some have taken it too far and it distracts us from who should be the sole receptor of all honor, glory and power - the Lord Jesus Christ. I wish we could skip the arguments because they are never resolved and people leave hurt and offended. I wish it were not so!
I am eager to say that I find no Scriptural "proof" of either of the big Marian Dogmata. So I don't see it as "necessary" that way either.
As far as I know, the arbutus is not necessary, nor the rose. Heck, the rose doesn't even give nectar, and its wild cousin is a noxious weed.
Now this is not an argument for the dogmata. It's scarcely an argument at all. So be gentle. (And I wasn't riled up. It was more like waking up and having somebody hand you a refrigerator and say, "Listen, just carry this to the third floor, would you? Coffee will be ready when you get back.")
If I hear, "Why is that necessary?" I guess I'm thinking the questioner views the 'that' as some kind of burden or nuisance, like, "Yet ANOTHER thing that's hard to believe, and I gotta believe it, they say."
But where I'm coming from, both as somebody who at least a little bit of the time is bowled over by the "shaken down, pressed together, running over" quality of the generosity of God, and as somebody with a growing devotion to Mary, necessary doesn't enter into it.
"WOW!" enters into it! "Is God ever AMAZING!" enters into it. "This is so COOL!" enters into it.
"The Lord has done great things for me," she sings. And we go, "WOW! I'll say!"
Now as to why the popes in question "declared and defined" it, that is for the historians. All I know is that there seems to have been a sort of world-wide request for them to make the declarations. There was lots of thinking either way, as you say. Aquinas, not knowing embryology was we do, was not so sure about conception being an instant and about when the fetus was developed enough to be anything at all, much less human. But there was a groundswell of people evidently writing to their pastors, their bishops and to the Pope himself saying, Aw, come ON!" There was even at least one "alleged" miracle, that of the "miraculous medal". Briefly:
Saint Catherine Labouré .. [the first apparition, THEN]Now, I happen to believe this, though no Marian Apparitions are de Fide. But you can imagine that those who believed it would think that the "conceived without sin" part of the medal prayer, supported - as the story goes - by many subsequent miracles and at least one astonishing conversion, would feel this was a good reason for the Church to get off the dime and make a declaration.
On November 27, 1830, Catherine reported that the Blessed Mother returned during evening meditations. She displayed herself inside an oval frame, standing upon a globe, wearing many rings of different colors, most of which shone rays of light over the globe. Around the margin of the frame appeared the words Ô Marie, conçue sans péche, priez pour nous qui avons recours à vous (in English, O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee)
Others who know more history than I can do a better job of why the decisions was made to make the declaration.