Posted on 05/25/2010 10:14:07 PM PDT by restornu
The reason the LDS tosses aside the trinity and limits the power of their “once a man like us” god is so they too can reach his level. That is a serious selling point, especially to those with serious egos.
An all powerful God, you know, like the REAL ONE, makes that moot.
Second, the only way the LDS can have any modicum of success is to try and deflect from the truth, since their own hand is empty when exposed to the light.
>>> I don’t believe that we lose our free will after we have received Christ. We still have the free will to give up our salvation (imo). No one can take it but we can forfeit it if that becomes our desire.
Free Will... such a horribly misunderstood concept.
If freedom comes from God, then how are the Godless free?
Who has more free will? those who separate themselves from God to gain freedom? or those who give at least some portion of that free will back to God from which it came?
Every sentient being (humans as well as angels) possess free will... but there is NO creature in creation with unlimited free will.... that of course is exclusive to God.
Every choice we make... every situation we are faced with comes with choices. However, those choices are limited. The free will we are given comes with limitations.
If you make the choice to sell your home, and sign your name to the contract, does your free will permit you to repossess the house?
If you really gave your life to God, and swore “not my will but Yours God”.... is it your right to take back what you have given to Him???
Would God call one to salvation whom He knows will at some point in the future destroy every ounce of effort He invested from the point of salvation forward?... only for that effort to become a shining example of failure for the enemy to wave like a banner of victory in God’s face?
How much money would you invest in your new home if you knew that the contract included an at-will repossession clause from the seller?
If you enter into marriage, are you not giving up some of your “free will” in exchange for the trust and loyalty of your spouse? What happens to free will there?
Oh... and before the issue of divorce is argued in response, please read the book of Hosea and consider why that book is in the bible at all.
God does not break His covenants... EVER.
Oh boy has I got a dilly!
Here is another pastor’s take on it. From L. R. Shelton.
The security of the believer in Christ Jesus.
1. The Scripture teaches God is the Author and Finisher of the believer’s faith and salvation.
Phl 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform [it] until the day of Jesus Christ:
Hbr 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of [our] faith;
Hbr 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
2. As Christ saves a sinner He keeps him saved, and we have nothing to do with keeping ourselves after we are saved.
Jhn 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Jhn 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.
Jhn 10:29 My Father, which gave [them] me, is greater than all; and no [man] is able to pluck [them] out of my Father’s hand.
Jhn 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
2Ti 1:12 .. nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.
Rom 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? [shall] tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?...
Rom 8:37 ...Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
Rom 8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
3.The Holy Spirit seals the believer unto redemption and makes our salvation doubly sure.
Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 1:13 ...after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Eph 1:14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
Jhn 5:24 ...He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4. How are sinners saved?...
1. By the new birth from above
Jhn 3:3 “Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God... Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again”
2. A new creation
2Cr 5:17 Therefore if any man [be] in Christ, [he is] a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
3. Not by works of the Law
Gal. 3:10-13
4. But by Faith
Gal 3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
Gal 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, [it is] evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
*****
I have another I will post on what a person must do to LOOSE their salvation.
Thank you. We’re all refreshed and challenged by your unique point of view. It sounds like English, but I can’t understand a word you’re saying.
I also have an article from the same preacher (L R Shelton) on what a believer must do to be lost.
1. He must take himself out of the Body of Christ into which he has been baptized by the Holy Spirit.
2. He must climb up to heaven and take from God his life which is hid in Christ.
3. He must pluck himself out of the hand of the Lord Jesus.
4. As he has been bought by Christ and no longer owns himself, he would have to sell himself if the original purchaser (God) agreed.
5.He must stop Christ from his Priestly work of intercession by which he is saved to the uttermost.
6.He must not believe when the scripture says the believer has eternal life and shall not fall into condemnation.
7. He must break the seal by which he has been sealed unto the day of redemption.
8. He must become ignorant of the fact that every child of God is..
a. Foreknown, predestinated, called, Justified, and glorified.
b. Perfected forever.
c. Complete in Christ.
d. Viewed by God as perfect in Christ.
9. He must wrest scripture from it’s context and shut his eyes to the general teaching of the word of God.
There is more but that is about all for now.
Would you reword this sentence? I know the words but strung together as you have done make no sense.
In mormon belief, salvation/exaltation is ONLY reached by accepting and fulfilling the terms of the "contract/covenant" via special/secret/sacred "ordinances". This "contract" is available ONLY through LDS Inc.
"Participation in sacred ordinances, both live and vicarious, and fidelity or obedience to the covenants associated with those ordinances are fundamental to the gospel of Jesus Christ and to the process of coming to Him and being perfected in Him.
It is on this fundamental role of ordinances and covenants that I would like to focus. In a very broad sense, everything ordained and established by God’s authority with the intent that it be applied in the lives of His children may be referred to as His ordinances. Consequently, the commandments, statutes, decrees, and requirements of God are properly defined as the ordinances of God. Understood in a somewhat narrower sense, ordinances are also solemn acts or ceremonies that have very specific sacred and holy purposes, significance, and meaning. My reference to ordinances is in this narrower application.
bump for later
70
>>> In mormon belief, salvation/exaltation is ONLY reached by accepting and fulfilling the terms of the “contract/covenant” via special/secret/sacred “ordinances”. This “contract” is available ONLY through LDS Inc.
yeah... thats what I hear... but I also hear that salvation and exaltation are not the same... that LDS exaltation is what we understand to be salvation, and that salvation itself in LDS terms refers only to the resurrection of the physical body itself.
However, they will talk about salvation to a non LDS Christian as if it were exaltation, and allow that presumption of “sameness” to exist as long as they are not questioned on it. They will even use salvation/exaltation in the same sentence as if they were synonymous terms.
Not that they do this intentionally, because most of them may not even understand the difference between the two terms according to their own scripture.
Difficult call, however IMHO, it is evident here that when pressed mormon will admit to the different definitions of the term 'salvation'. In their effort to costume themselves as Christians, they take many common Christian terms and redefine them to mask their true doctrine from the uneducated. Were they to walk up and say that salvation was becoming a god/dess, it wouldn't go over very well with the rest of the Christian-exposed community - they'd see that mormonism in the outer limits. Anything to win a convert.
Is that all you have did forget I am self taught...LOL
I have know idea what you just said.
***
May I translate for you friend!:)
I have know no idea what you just said.
Nicely done but I still have no idea what you said.
Being self taught has it advantages forces one into survival mode causing me to sharpens my discernment to think out of the box, to read between the lines or even to understand parables!
This is what I want you to reword because I do not no what you are trying to say.
Presently I am learning how to manuver around Windows 7
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