Posted on 04/30/2010 8:03:48 AM PDT by Quix
pshaw! Little ol' me? Thank you for your kindness, but those things belong to our Father. : )
I rebuke that allegation in the Name of Jesus, most fiercely.
Thank you for your defense. Our Lord was also accused of working for the devil, so I am thankful that He gives me the opportunity to be likewise accused. I'll happily take that spiritual *ka-ching* over any vindication.
Actually, they didn't, you can read it however you like, but they didn't say that.
Innocent III spoke of the "Church of the faithful" and Boniface VIII and Eugene IV both spoke of the Catholic Church. The word Catholic means UNIVERSAL.
mm: For others, like myself, they consider that I am going to hell.
wb: Actually, they don’t.
Actually some of the posters you’ve pinged have told me no less.
Then you won't have a problem providing a link.
It has been my experience that many non-Catholics believe what they WANT to believe about the Church and, of these, those who consider themselves "ex-Catholics" generally have the greatest misconceptions.
Are you suggesting that I won’t know loved ones in heaven? And that they’ll not be important to me?
It is a question I’ve pondered long and hard, because it’s a question that parishoners are wont to ask of a pastor.
My sense is that just because they don’t give in marriage in heaven doesn’t mean my memory banks will be wiped clean. If that were the case, there’d be no point in having the Lamb crucified there. There’d be no point in wiping tears from our eyes.
Is Jesus yet resurrected? Is that resurrected body yet real or did it get done away with? Was it not the old body renewed? And did not Mary have somewhat to do with that?
This is not an issue of statues or beads. This is a real life bible question, and I’m on the side of our knowing each other, our memories being intact, and our salvation being a realized eternal gift.
Otherwise, what is the difference in terms of our identity between heaven and nirvana? Either way, you wouldn’t know who you had been.
“Prottie” is from Quix. he used that term for all y’all.
Bowing down to a likeness that you take to be a god is a violation of commandment.
I agree with you on that.
Yet, at the same time, Wm, I’ve been amused at Christmas time for it is “protestant icon hour”. They pull out the stops with “Nativity Scenes”. Large ones, small ones, plastic ones, carved ones, lighted ones, living ones, and fabulously arrranged ones.
Entire programs are built around coming to ooooh and aaaaahh over the Graven Images of Mary, Joseph, Shepherds, Christ Child, etc.
What if Catholics simply oooohhh and aaaahhh all year long instead of just at Christmas?
Whatever, no one has a hissy meltdown over it
I speak for myself, thanks.
Or anything else we might get up to? They are beyond that
What if Aunt Zelda still loves you?
And she must be at least interested. Otherwise why say, “We’re surrounded by a great cloud of witnesses.”?
If we have God to answer our prayers, why do we need to pray to anyone else for things?
Can they do something for us that God can’t?
WILL they do something for us that God won’t?
Like the guy who looked across the gulf in the bible, he wasn't exactly in heaven was he?
Vanity, like it says in Jeremiah, we do it because it just feels so good, and besides, it’s our tradition, so Jeremiah, take a boat out of here, don’t bug us anymore
Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
You are assuming facts not in evidence re the witnesses. No one can be sure where Zelda is, once she leaves earth. Besides Catholics buy the Zeldas a ticket to Purgatory, so if she’s there she isn’t able to help herself, let alone anyone else. We do know angels observe us,, and so are likely the great cloud, but we have no proof one way or another about the others.
I'm not big on ecumenism myself, wmfights. That is not what I have tried to promote here — merely to raise a caution about judging the spiritual condition of other people.
Revelation 5:8 speaks of the prayers of the saints. While there are certainly saints on earth, it is also true that ALL of the saved in Heaven are also saints and if they pray that means they have wishes and desires and, as they are in Paradise, logic would dictate that their prayers are for those they love who are not yet with them.
INDEED.
?
your logic? The bible says differently, the saints are busy praising God
“Are you suggesting that I won’t know loved ones in heaven? And that they’ll not be important to me?”
No, what I am suggesting is that the knowing of one another and the affections for one another is a reflection of the universal love that Christ has for his church. It is an inclusive love that brooks no exclusive, selfish love. We are one in the Lord.
“My sense is that just because they don’t give in marriage in heaven doesn’t mean my memory banks will be wiped clean.”
There will be no nostalgia in heaven. It is clear what Jesus said about “hating” mother and father or son and daughter. If that is the comparative standard we strive for here, what will be the relationship when we are perfected?
“If that were the case, there’d be no point in having the Lamb crucified there. There’d be no point in wiping tears from our eyes.”
That is the point of loving the Lord with all heart, soul, mind and strength. There is no room for a competing affection.
“Is Jesus yet resurrected? Is that resurrected body yet real or did it get done away with? Was it not the old body renewed? And did not Mary have somewhat to do with that?”
Mary’s contribution died when Jesus died and was buried when Jesus was buried. The Father by the Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead.
“Otherwise, what is the difference in terms of our identity between heaven and nirvana? Either way, you wouldn’t know who you had been.”
1Cr 15:35-38, “But some [man] will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? [Thou] fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other [grain]: But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.”
1Cr 15:39-44, “All flesh [is] not the same flesh: …..So also [is] the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
1Cr 15:45 “And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam [was made] a quickening spirit. Howbeit that [was] not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. The first man [is] of the earth, earthy: the second man [is] the Lord from heaven. As [is] the earthy, such [are] they also that are earthy: and as [is] the heavenly, such [are] they also that are heavenly.”
1Cr 15:49-54, “And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal [must] put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.”
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