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Posted on 04/18/2010 9:49:35 PM PDT by Judith Anne
I seriously wonder about some FReepers, sometimes. Any other person accused of a crime would be defended by every FReeper as being innocent until proven guilty by a court of law. I've seen whole threads written by men who have been accused of child abuse by ex-wives out to deny them their visitation rights or to wrest more money out of them. These men are rightly indignant, and furious about the unjust accusations that cannot be proven but are never withdrawn.
Yet where are those FReepers when a PRIEST is accused? Where is the presumption of innocence? Suddenly, every accusation becomes a verdict, and not only the accused but his entire organization and all its adherents are held responsible.
I can only wonder what some of these so-called conservatives (who so faithfully defend the Constitution) would do, if THEY were the ones accused! It is a nightmare for any man -- all of you know how even the accusation stains the man forever, even if it is proven false!
Not only that, many here assert that the problems of 30, 40 and even 50 years ago must be tried in the media TODAY!
Remember the Duke rape case? There are more similarities than differences here. The priests are accused, nifonged, and instead of being defended, they are vilified!
What other man of you could stand under the weight of such an accusation trumpeted by the press, and come out whole? None! And such accusations made, LONG after the statute of limitations has passed, sometimes even after the accused is dead and buried for YEARS -- are YOU one of those who automatically, reflexively, spitefully, and gleefully act as judge, jury, and executioner?
Women! What if it were YOUR HUSBAND, YOUR BROTHER, YOUR FATHER, YOUR UNCLE, YOUR SON who was accused? Wouldn't you want the best defense possible? Wouldn't YOU believe in their innocence? Wouldn't YOU help protect your loved ones as much as possible? And yet, YOU JUDGE THE CHURCH FOR DOING WHAT YOU WOULD DO?
Shame! Vast shame! On all who have sinned against the innocent!
Would one of you mind telling me where I posted that God made a mistake with Paul?
God knows me inside and out. He is not clueless about anything. Nor have I ever said He is.
*
So very true. Obviously, dear brother in Christ, that sort of thing is simply evidence that the parties involved may very well have lost their First Love.... Ironically: for "tradition-bound institutions" of the Christian type were originally organized to serve, protect, and promulgate the First Love — God the Father, His only-begotten Son, and the Holy Spirit, signifying the divine love both within the Trinity, and between the Trinity and mankind.
Yet as you note, there is a "foul element in human nature" — which operates almost like the law of gravity — that just "naturally" tends to manifest this sort of falling away from the First Love....
You wrote:
Nevertheless we are wise to use our mirrors exhaustively—and to ask Holy Spirit for HIS SEARCH LIGHT ON OUR deceitfully wicked hearts before playing Don Quixote with the windmills.I so agree. As far as the tendency for corruption is concerned — which we ALL inherit from fallen Adam — we are ALL of us in the same boat. Mortal Christians, of course, are not exempt from the consequences of Adam's original sin.... We ourselves can do nothing about this. Only the Blood of Jesus Christ can release us from this miserable condition of human nature.
You wrote:
...there really ARE CHRISTIANS WHO LOVE JESUS on all sides of these issues. We COULD spend a BIT MORE TIME acting and sounding like it.Here I take you to mean that regardless of denominational affiliation/creedal differences, a Christian is a CHRISTIAN; and we all should try to treat each other with Christian charity, not sticks and brickbats. [That would be nice. :^)]
It seems to me we should always try to remember the parable of "motes" and "beams".... And also the clear warning: Judge not, lest ye shall be judged.
In the end, only God alone truly knows His own. That judgment has nothing to do with mere human opinion, according to whatever criteria you or I or anybody else might wish to apply....
Thank you, thank you, for Luke 18:13:
And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.And so I pray: May God be merciful to me, a sinner.
And may He bless you, dear brother, for your wise and truly illuminating essay/post!
Paul stood on Mars hill and more than held his own with the great philosophers of Greece. He stood before Agrippa and preached eloquently to the court. Hardly a madman
bickering about Saint Paul...who cares. Maybe it was a near death experince...maybe his horse was spooked by a snake and he hit his head on landing. Maybe God has a sense of humor and knocked this jew off his horse. Maybe the thorn in his side was a broken rib from falling off the horse that never healed. Maybe it was the guilt of killing Christians. This man who killed Saint Stephen our first martyr... who also killed many Christians was transformed in an instant and became a Christian. The first missionary who was also martyred in spreading the gospel of the Good News. Who cares... God chose him and God wants us. So what...we’re all cracked pots and so were they....isn’t that great. And God used them anyway and He can use us if we let Him...
Why focus on the words in red, when the whole of the Bible is God’s word? Does red ink make it superior?
Judy, You are the one denigrated St Paul, not me.
Again, is this your original idea or Catholic teaching?
How about 2 Peter 3:15-16?
Your kind and humbling words touch me more deeply than I can well respond to.
THANKS TONS.
BLESSED BE THE NAME OF THE LORD.
BLESSED BE THE WORD OF THE LORD.
BLESSED BE THE WAYS OF THE LORD.
BLESSED BE THOSE WHO LOVE THE LORD.
HIS KINGDOM COME, HIS WILL BE DONE IN ALL OUR HEARTS AND LIVES AND ON EARTH AS IT IS IN HEAVEN.
You seem quite skilled at inference . . . at least in your own eyes.
It’s logical to assume that God is at least as skilled about folks dinigrating HIS CHIEF NT scribe.
Some Bible publisher decided red ink was a useful gimmick to sell Bibles.
In reality it's ALL red ink.
“I’m quite attached to the Pauline letters’
And so am I.
I do think we might take into account that he was writing to various communities of believers, and could very easily have been adapting his style and content to the particular commmunity he was addressing.
It wouldn’t surprise me to hear someone say that this is one possible explanation for the way his letters are perceived/received.
The official Catholic position is that Paul got everything right, but those Protestant reform revisionists have completely twisted and misinterpreted his words into an entirely new Gospel that serves their heretical beliefs.
When I read the Bible, I read it as though God is talking to me, personally. The posters here seem to think that just because some words are in red ink, they are NO MORE IMPORTANT OR SIGNIFICANT than any other words in the Bible.
When I was an unbeliever, I imagined being one of the people who followed Christ around, one of the hangers-on during His earthly life, and that He was speaking to me. The plain, unvarnished and humble narrative of the gospel writers also makes sense to me.
So, unless Christ’s words heard by and written down by humans who loved Him, who were trying as hard as I was to know Who Christ IS!
I am not playing any game. And I’m not going to make it pleasant or easy for anyone who wants to attack me for liking some books of the Bible more than others and NOT liking some saints, or to bully me into liking a flaming loony like St. Paul was.
I do not like St. Paul. I have never liked St. Paul. I doubt I will ever like him. God can do anything, however, and I submit myself to Him. Not to YOU.
Red ink doesn’t make “it” superior. Christ’s words when He was one of us, the Living Son of God on Earth, are superior to anything else in the Good Book. In. My. Opinion.
Heh. ;-D
Good grief. Paul wrote a significant portion of the NT. If you’re going to dismiss him like that, you must end up dismissing the NT books he wrote.
FWIW, I find it ironic that Catholics find fault with Scripture like that they claim the Catholic Church fathers themselves wrote.
If the Catholic Church is responsible for writing the NT, then why would they put in so many things that cause so many difficulties for the Catholic Church?
The Catholic Church is now in a position of trying to justify many of its doctrines which cannot be supported by a clear, plain reading of Scripture. If the RC Church held more closely to the Scripture it claimed it wrote, it would have to change its current doctrinal position on things, instead f elevating tradition to equal station as Scripture to justify them.
I will not insinuate that I don't like St. Paul, I will state it right out. God knows what I think. No point lying or insinuating anything.
Well, it is your opinion, and everybody has one.
I choose to believe that ALL the words in the Bible are the words of God, not just the red ones. The words of Jesus ARE the Bible, not just the gospels.
I don’t dismiss St. Paul. I just don’t like him. Or much of what he wrote.
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