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Posted on 04/18/2010 9:49:35 PM PDT by Judith Anne
I seriously wonder about some FReepers, sometimes. Any other person accused of a crime would be defended by every FReeper as being innocent until proven guilty by a court of law. I've seen whole threads written by men who have been accused of child abuse by ex-wives out to deny them their visitation rights or to wrest more money out of them. These men are rightly indignant, and furious about the unjust accusations that cannot be proven but are never withdrawn.
Yet where are those FReepers when a PRIEST is accused? Where is the presumption of innocence? Suddenly, every accusation becomes a verdict, and not only the accused but his entire organization and all its adherents are held responsible.
I can only wonder what some of these so-called conservatives (who so faithfully defend the Constitution) would do, if THEY were the ones accused! It is a nightmare for any man -- all of you know how even the accusation stains the man forever, even if it is proven false!
Not only that, many here assert that the problems of 30, 40 and even 50 years ago must be tried in the media TODAY!
Remember the Duke rape case? There are more similarities than differences here. The priests are accused, nifonged, and instead of being defended, they are vilified!
What other man of you could stand under the weight of such an accusation trumpeted by the press, and come out whole? None! And such accusations made, LONG after the statute of limitations has passed, sometimes even after the accused is dead and buried for YEARS -- are YOU one of those who automatically, reflexively, spitefully, and gleefully act as judge, jury, and executioner?
Women! What if it were YOUR HUSBAND, YOUR BROTHER, YOUR FATHER, YOUR UNCLE, YOUR SON who was accused? Wouldn't you want the best defense possible? Wouldn't YOU believe in their innocence? Wouldn't YOU help protect your loved ones as much as possible? And yet, YOU JUDGE THE CHURCH FOR DOING WHAT YOU WOULD DO?
Shame! Vast shame! On all who have sinned against the innocent!
Wolsey had no authority at Worms, and was safely dead before Tyndale was seized. Remember that Tyndale was captured by an agent of Henry in Belgium, not Worms. Thomas More was also safely dead before Tyndale was seized - killed by Tudor for angering him by attacking his personal life. I would argue that most modern day Americans have no idea of the anger that 16th century monarchs had towards any criticism of their personal lives, and the number of people that were killed in Europe in retribution for real or imagined insults to the monarch.
bookmark
“Sounds kind of spiteful to me.
I just don’t see the point for someone to go to that level to make a point.”
Hey! I didn’t make this up. I just reported the TRUTH as to what actually happened.
If thats spiteful and going “to that level” the true facts must hit a nerve.
I would think that digging up someone’s remains and burning them is the Ultimate in being spiteful and descending to a Low Level.
“To him the HS is the third fiddle, and only the Father is called God.”
Paul in his writings has a high view of the person and work of the Holy Spirit; equating him with God and using his name interchangeably with God.
1 Cor. 2:10, “God has revealed those things to us by his Spirit. The Spirit searches everything, especially the deep things of God.”
Rom. 8:26-27, “At the same time the Spirit also helps us in our weakness, because we don’t know how to pray for what we need. But the Spirit intercedes along with our groans that cannot be expressed in words. The one who searches our hearts knows what the Spirit has in mind. The Spirit intercedes for God’s people the way God wants him to”.
1 Cor. 3:16, “Don’t you know that you are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit lives in you?”
1 Cor. 6:19, “Don’t you know that your body is a temple that belongs to the Holy Spirit? The Holy Spirit, whom you received from God, lives in you. You don’t belong to yourselves.”
Rom. 8:2, “The standards of the Spirit, who gives life through Christ Jesus, have set you free from the standards of sin and death.”
Rom. 15:30, “Brothers and sisters, I encourage you through our Lord Jesus Christ and by the love that the Spirit creates, to join me in my struggle. Pray to God for me “
2 Cor. 13:14, “May the Lord Jesus Christ’s good will, God’s love, and the Holy Spirit’s presence be with all of you!”
1 Cor. 12:5-7, “There are different ways of serving, and yet the same Lord is served. There are different types of work to do, but the same God produces every gift in every person. The evidence of the Spirit’s presence is given to each person for the common good of everyone.”
The point is, MarkBsnr, that the pursuit of Tyndale by the Catholic monarchy began in 1525. The pursuit of Tyndale continued despite what so many mistakenly believe to be the Protestant conversion of Henry VIII. He, himself, never embraced Protestantism. He hated Protestants, he had them killed and his Lord Chancellor Thomas More followed through in spectacular fashion for his king. The dissolution of Catholic monasteries did not begin until the year of Tyndale’s death. The Six Acts of 1539 affirmed Catholic religious belief. The country vacillated back and forth between killing Protestants and killing Catholics for over a century afterward. To attempt to claim that Tyndale was killed by state authorities acting against the plain interests of the Catholic church, established over a decade before and well before any putative “conversion” or excommunication, is not intellectually honest and is not historically accurate.
It’s the ultimate in being petty.
“Iucunda Semper Expectatione
On the Rosary
His Holiness Pope Leo XIII
September 8, 1894
To the Partiarchs, Primates, Archbishops, Bishops, and other Ordinaries in Peace and Communion with the Apostolic See.
Venerable Brethren, Greeting and Apostolic Benediction.
2. The recourse we have to Mary in prayer follows upon the office she continuously fills by the side of the throne of God as Mediatrix of Divine grace; being by worthiness and by merit most acceptable to Him, and, therefore, surpassing in power all the angels and saints in Heaven. Now, this merciful office of hers, perhaps, appears in no other form of prayer so manifestly as it does in the Rosary. For in the Rosary all the part that Mary took as our co-Redemptress comes to us, as it were, set forth, and in such wise as though the facts were even then taking place; and this with much profit to our piety, whether in the contemplation of the succeeding sacred mysteries, or in the prayers which we speak and repeat with the lips.”
Leo did not understand or not know the Catechism?
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that naturewill reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. 10Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers.
kosta50, Is there someone else from whom we reap eternal life besides God?
Pope Leo knew the Catechism as certainly as you don't. His statement was not unqualified. In calling Mary the Mediatrix of all graces, the Church does not mean that she is a rival for Jesus’ unique place. Vatican II clarified the Church’s position on 1 Timothy 2:5–6:
The maternal duty of Mary toward men in no way obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ but rather shows its power. For all the saving influences of the Blessed Virgin on men originate not from some inner necessity but from the divine pleasure. They flow from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rest on his mediation, depend entirely on it, and draw all their power from it. In no way do they impede the immediate union of the faithful with Christ. Rather, they foster this union. (LG 60)
Christ makes it possible for Mary to mediate grace and desires her to do so because he has planned it that way.
Knowing, then, that the Church cannot teach error, we are able, by faith, to accept that Mary is the Mediatrix of all graces. But faith seeks understanding.
[There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. - Romans 8:1
But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. - John 14:26
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned. - I Cor 2:13-14
“It’s like he’s trying to speak to me, I know it. Look, you’re really cute, but I can’t understand what you’re saying.”
Can you make this out?
http://www.catholicplanet.com/CMA/
No answer yet.
Night....
If pointing out actual facts of a situation is being petty, then I’m guilty. I think the whole stinking story is petty.
I think a Pope understands the Catholic doctrine better than Nat. Law does.
And Paul just forgot to mention Mary to Timothy?
Wow. Well done.
Sure, it's easy. Co-redeemer isn't co-Redeemer, it's co-redeemer but not really. And Mary stands at the side of God but kneels too before Christ.
“Mary is not a co-Redeemer and is not able to save anyone, not even with and under Christ.”
But on the other hand,
“Thus is confirmed that law of merciful meditation of which We have spoken, and which St. Bernardine of Siena thus expresses: “Every grace granted to man has three degrees in order; for by God it is communicated to Christ, from Christ it passes to the Virgin, and from the Virgin it descends to us.”
But then again.......
“Iucunda Semper Expectatione
On the Rosary
His Holiness Pope Leo XIII
September 8, 1894
To the Partiarchs, Primates, Archbishops, Bishops, and other Ordinaries in Peace and Communion with the Apostolic See.
Venerable Brethren, Greeting and Apostolic Benediction.
2. The recourse we have to Mary in prayer follows upon the office she continuously fills by the side of the throne of God as Mediatrix of Divine grace; being by worthiness and by merit most acceptable to Him, and, therefore, surpassing in power all the angels and saints in Heaven. Now, this merciful office of hers, perhaps, appears in no other form of prayer so manifestly as it does in the Rosary. For in the Rosary all the part that Mary took as our co-Redemptress comes to us, as it were, set forth, and in such wise as though the facts were even then taking place; and this with much profit to our piety, whether in the contemplation of the succeeding sacred mysteries, or in the prayers which we speak and repeat with the lips.”
Leo did not understand or not know the Catechism?
- - - -
INDEED.
However, as we have seen . . . the rabid clique sorts of Roman Catholics et al hereon don’t seem to be interested in facts.
They seemingly get a LOT more white hanky thrills out of writing out of both sides of their fingers and pretending that God is too clueless to notice.
I suspect some very rude awakenings are ahead.
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