[Cronos]

Mother of God" can easily make my skin crawl if I think much about it. It's extremely blasphemously offensive to me. And there's NO WAY I can communicate that to you effectively.

And yet you said IF A PANEL OF HIGH QUALITY, FAIR-MINDED, SKILLFUL, BEST INFORMED SCHOLARS

were to program a computer with all the available knowledge weighted fair-mindedly in a way that both sides agreed was honorable and fitting

And then set on the task of arriving at the best summaries of the linguistic etc. meanings and evidences,

that the computer would arrive at the same conclusions

as the Councils did when setting the doctrine of The Church

The Councils CALLED Mary Theotokos, Mother of God because that glorifies GOD, Jesus Christ

you do believe that Jesus was wholly man and wholly God, correct? If you do, then Mary was the Mother of this entire person -- she was not His creator by any means, but she was His mother.

The phrase "Mother of God" which seems to offend you is meant to glorify GOD, not Mary.

[Quix]

because that glorifies GOD, Jesus Christ

The phrase "Mother of God" . . . is meant to glorify GOD, not Mary.

#####################################################

It boggles my mind that ANYONE could make such a contention . . . and believe that anyone else would believe it.

1. Have had a fair amount of training and experience in FAMILY SYSTEMS THERAPY. One of the themes is re-establishing some order to a chaotic family. That frequently involves establishing Dad as Dad--getting him to ACT LIKE THE DAD and to be respected as the dad. Order.

2. Either Mary is less than God, or she's equal to God or she's greater than God.

3. IF, as Vatican associates et al acknowledge (much of the time--when they aren't ACTING AND WRITING OTHERWISE) that Mary is less than God (though ALMOST equal--according to a vast array of writings) THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NO WAY--in terms of rank and discussions of rank--THAT CALLING THE LESSER MOTHER OF THE GREATER IS A WAY TO BRING GLORY TO THE GREATER.

WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO:
Ronald Reagan to call Cindy Sheehan the mother of Ronald Reagan?
.
WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO:
Abraham Lincoln to call Che Guevara the father of Abraham Lincoln?
.
WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO:
Chuck Norris to call BoxerFace the mother of Chuck Norris?
.
WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO:
Pope Benedict to call Teddy Kennedy the illegitimate father of Pope Benedict?
.
WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO:
Pope Jean Paul II to call Shrillery Klintoon the mother of Pope Jean Paul II?
.
WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO:
Professor Higgins to call Liza Doolittle the mother of Professor Higgins?
.
WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO:
Sarah Palin to call Barney Frank the father of Sarah Palin?
.
WOULD IT BRING GLORY TO FRANK LLOYD WRIGHT to call some Aussie Bushman mama skilled at lean-to's his Mamma?
.
HOW could it possibly bring Glory to:
The King to call the lowly serf--no matter how pure--his mother?
.
4. I realize that Madison Avenue and any politically powerful bureaucratic magicsterical of any denomination can do wonders . . . in any era . . . however, there ARE functional, practical, possible limits on reality!

5. Logically, dyanmically, contextually, culturally, ordinally, emphasizing Mary as the MOTHER OF GOD IS A BRAZENLY TRANSPARENT and largely successful effort to bring God down to Mary's level that she may appear more at God's level--in the minds, at least, of the eager Mary acolytes.

6. I believe there are GROUP-THINK, MASS propaganda, MASS MANIPULATION reasons for this--hatched in hell--but that's a whole 'nother discussion.

7. It's grieveously disturbing that ANYONE IN ANY GROUP could even imagine that a feudal, vested interest oriented bunch of bureaucratic power-mongers 1600-1700 years ago were as objective and fair-minded as a very objectively programmed computer would be. It boggles my mind that folks could look themselves in their eyes in their mirrors and unflinchingly assert that and walk away believing it.

8. My observed reality is that there's a centuries old GREAT DECEPTION going on here . . . and rare--very rarely do those immersed in it see the least corner of the huge deception . . . while many of those outside of it experience it slapping them in the face relentlessly.

9. AS with a lot of things about RELIGION--it's not even rational. It's EMOTIONAL. It is hooked to and plays on all mankind's deepest, most intense, archetypal heart-strings--those tied to MOMMY.

10. The pseudo rational elements are . . . cobbled together as after-thoughts in terms of their quality and reliability. Anything and everything, including the kitchen sink, is tossed in to justify the unjustifiable.

I have compassion for those immersed in the GREAT DECEPTION. I have outrage at the forces so actively deceiving folks.

[Iscool]

The phrase "Mother of God" which seems to offend you is meant to glorify GOD, not Mary.

You've got to be kidding...Is that what they told you at your baptism???

[Cvengr]

Since Jesus Christ is the Alpha and Omega, it is deceptive to refer to Mary as the Mother of God. She indeed is the mother of our Lord Christ Jesus, and in His humanity, she bore Him as her son, but He is the Son of God and the son of man, albeit the second Adam.

[Mad Dawg]

The Councils CALLED Mary Theotokos, Mother of God because that glorifies GOD, Jesus Christ

This is critical. Whatever one makes of the later elaborations and unfolding, the core proclamation is Christological, as the Annunciation is a Christological and not in the first instance a Marian Feast.