Posted on 01/05/2010 9:46:47 PM PST by the_conscience
I just witnessed a couple of Orthodox posters get kicked off a "Catholic Caucus" thread. I thought, despite their differences, they had a mutual understanding that each sect was considered "Catholic". Are not the Orthodox considered Catholic? Why do the Romanists get to monopolize the term "Catholic"?
I consider myself to be Catholic being a part of the universal church of Christ. Why should one sect be able to use a universal concept to identify themselves in a caucus thread while other Christian denominations need to use specific qualifiers to identify themselves in a caucus thread?
I am certain that, sadly, you are correct.
Thanks for your kind reply.
The disrespect for the facts of my congregation’s realities was, perhaps, significant and a bit annoying.
However, it was not the most offensive thing to me.
I suppose I tend to sluff off most insults—even outrageous ones—as so much par for the course of being human—particularly being a bird-of-rare-plumage human wherein such are very much par for the course . . . all these 63 years.
And, I suppose I could say I was personally hurt. And that would be true enough. Yet even the hurt was not, per se, emotionally intense.
I was grieved and that was not off the scale intense.
However, I realized that here was an outrageous post . . . with follow-up claws and spear stabs seemingly very intently delivered . . .
initially by a photograph I’d taken to be a good faith communication . . . yet which was an outrageous satire.
Certainly, who am I to complain about outrageous satire. And I’m happy to insist that all such should have a right and place in intense debate and even dialogue.
However, here was a relationship—no—that’s not quite accurate—here was the assummption and the appearance—a fantasy of a relationship wherein mutual earnest effort was being made toward greatly reducing if not eliminating the worst of the hostile and ugly postings back and forth beteen Prottys and Vatican related folks hereon.
And SUDDENLY it became PAINFULLY OBVIOUS that there was ABSOLUTELY NO GROUNDS for trusting the other person in the relationship—whatsoever.
THAT hurt. That was sad.
Perhaps it was sad and hurtful partly because I’d been so foolish as to think otherwise was possible, in the first place. And that’s sad.
And it troubles me to see this identity argument between my brothers and sisters in Christ because I do indeed see a "common ground." Indeed, recognizing our brothers and sisters in Him is a crucial part of discerning the body of Christ in I Cor 11-12.
For the body is not one member, but many. - I Cor 12:12-14
But the three of us, although we may differ in Spiritual insight and have opposing doctrines or understandings of Scripture, worship the same Triune God.
After all, the Spirit of God cannot be contained by any side in a debate among Christians.
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet [given]; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.) – John 7:38-39
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and [of] the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. - John 3:5-8
And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning. Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as [he did] unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God? – Acts 11:15-17
Which Catholic has been brainwashed to lie about what you believe?
Can you point out a post where you think that happened?
Before John of Damascus was Isaiah
But between them both was the Incarnation of Christ.
Which Catholic has been brainwashed to lie about what you believe?
Can you point out a post where you think that happened?
But the Heavenly Father says he has NO part of man established dates/feasts associated with the moon. NO matter what John of Damascus penned.
Before John of Damascus was Isaiah
But between them both was the Incarnation of Christ.
And who decided there should be a 'feast' for the Incarnation certainly no canonized writer of the WORD. But hey we each do get to captain our own ship and pronounce what it is we celebrate through this flesh age. Clean up comes when Christ returns with that 'double' edged sword the WORD.
In December there are three holy days that are of note (regarding this subject). The memorial of St. Nickolaus, Dec 6th; The Solemnity of the Immaculate Conception, Dec 8th; and the Solemnity of the Nativity, Dec 25th. In the Americas, particularly among Hispanics, the Feast of Our Lady of Guadalupe, Dec 12th, is also very popular. But the presents and all are typically associated with Epiphany, January 6th.
I bring that up because the children usually will receive candy and what we call "stocking stuffers" on St. Nickolaus day. And the Christmas presents are, in several cultures, distributed on Ephiphany (commemorating the Magi bringing presents to the infant Jesus). The Solemnity of the Nativity is a huge thing, but it is moreso a huge RELIGIOUS thing rather than a huge party thing.
Probably what they were talking about was the Feast of Our Lady of Guadalupe, Dec 12th. Very briefly, what that commemorates was the apparition of the Virgin Mary to a converted Aztec Indian named Juan Diego. I'm sure if you work with Hispanics, you've seen the image of Our Lady of Guadalupe on their pickup trucks and all over the place. That image, miraculously, appeared on Juan Diego's tilma (cloak). It is still preserved in the shrine built in Mexico City to commemorate it. The significance was that before that time, the Spanish missionaries had minimal success in conversions but afterward there were floods of converts. So, in truth, the significance of that holiday is the conversion of the Americas to Christ.
Yes, you are right that the Solemnity of the Nativity is far more significant, obviously. But the conversion of the Americas (specifically the Aztecs) is nothing to sneeze at.
And who decided there should be a 'feast' for the Incarnation certainly no canonized writer of the WORD
The Holy Church of God, inspired and guided by the Spirit of Christ as he promised. So we celebrate the Annunciation every March. (Christmas is really more about the Nativity than the Incarnation itself.)
Given the choice of put up or shut up, you chose shut up.
The fact remains, Catholics aren’t misrepresenting your faith...not because of brainwashing or for any other reason.
mad dawg>>No. Ou're church just thinks its a little silly for someone to say,"Your church exercises too much, no, not enough, no, too much, no, insufficient but excessive, yeah, that's it, insufficient but excessive control over it's members and message."
MD, don't you think he could be, in the second person, referring to that dissident group We Are Church? (We're Church)
If that is, in fact, the case, I would be in full agreement with Mr. wmfights. They are not accountable. They are also incorrigible.
Especially if I considered myself a downtrodden people, I'd tend to boogie heartily at the commemoration of my people's conversion through an amazing act of Love on the part of God.
Please point me to all the scripture that teaches salvation is all about you and your works and faith
Quix, it’s a shame that you feel/felt hurt. I can identiry. But on the open threads, where you spend most of your time (I rarely if ever see you on an ecumenical thread) we are to have “thick-skin.”
Please think back to some of the anti-Catholic posts....were any of them yours? It would be immature for ANYONE to say, “The other guy did it first!”
Come, let us reason together. Antipathy begets antipathy. Surely the opposite can also be true. Who will take the first step here?
May the Lord Jesus Christ, Risen Son of the Almighty I AM, grant us all a spirit of peace and humility. We must stand together as followers of our Lord and Savior, despite our differences, because there are enemies without the gate...Of course we know how the story ends, with the King of Glory triumphant over evil, but we are called to do our part.
Asked and answered. It’s good to stay caught up.
(Pssst. Wrong. It’s all about ME.)
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