One thing I love about Japanese anime is that their concept of Catholicism is . . . a little off center.
They are not alone.
Posted on 01/05/2010 9:46:47 PM PST by the_conscience
I just witnessed a couple of Orthodox posters get kicked off a "Catholic Caucus" thread. I thought, despite their differences, they had a mutual understanding that each sect was considered "Catholic". Are not the Orthodox considered Catholic? Why do the Romanists get to monopolize the term "Catholic"?
I consider myself to be Catholic being a part of the universal church of Christ. Why should one sect be able to use a universal concept to identify themselves in a caucus thread while other Christian denominations need to use specific qualifiers to identify themselves in a caucus thread?
You weren't given anything...You usurped it...
Are you saying that the Church that Christ created is more powerful than God? Is there anything that you have posted lately that is actually true?
Punch line is: "Pepperlepep, dumme Blae, halt de Schnuten un lat de Möhme kühren!"
"Fiddle faddle, you silly brat, hold your tongue and let your mother speak!"
That post does not describe the Catholic Church.
One thing I love about Japanese anime is that their concept of Catholicism is . . . a little off center.
They are not alone.
You called your raised platform, the steps up to it and the space in front of it an altar. The Church's altar is a table. We are different there.
Your stage is a place of entertainment or the place to put on a show; where the actors perform. The altar is a place of a re-presentation of the Sacrifice of Jesus. Your entertainers versus our priests. We are different there.
BTW, That pic looks like it was taken in a huge outdoor worship setting or an arena type huge indoor setting. I think it's wonderful when that many youth will mass together to worship God. PRAISE GOD!
Only if God's name is really Jimi Hendrix, the worship setting is in Woodstock, and the sacraments are either smoked or snorted. I think that you may mean - praise Timothy Leary.
Has Luke been redacted from your Bible as well?
Luke 1: 26 10 In the sixth month, the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a town of Galilee called Nazareth, 27 to a virgin betrothed to a man named Joseph, of the house of David, and the virgin's name was Mary. 28 And coming to her, he said, "Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you." 29 But she was greatly troubled at what was said and pondered what sort of greeting this might be. 30 Then the angel said to her, "Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31 Behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall name him Jesus. 32 He will be great and will be called Son of the Most High, 11 and the Lord God will give him the throne of David his father, 33 and he will rule over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end."
34 But Mary said to the angel, "How can this be, since I have no relations with a man?" 12 35 And the angel said to her in reply, "The holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. Therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God. 36 And behold, Elizabeth, your relative, has also conceived 13 a son in her old age, and this is the sixth month for her who was called barren; 37 for nothing will be impossible for God." 38 Mary said, "Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord. May it be done to me according to your word." Then the angel departed from her.
39 During those days Mary set out and traveled to the hill country in haste to a town of Judah, 40 where she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. 41 When Elizabeth heard Mary's greeting, the infant leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth, filled with the holy Spirit, 42 cried out in a loud voice and said, "Most blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb. 43 And how does this happen to me, that the mother of my Lord 14 should come to me? 44 For at the moment the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy. 45 Blessed are you who believed 15 that what was spoken to you by the Lord would be fulfilled."
46 And Mary said: 16 "My soul proclaims the greatness of the Lord; 47 my spirit rejoices in God my savior. 48 For he has looked upon his handmaid's lowliness; behold, from now on will all ages call me blessed. 49 The Mighty One has done great things for me, and holy is his name. 50 His mercy is from age to age to those who fear him. 51 He has shown might with his arm, dispersed the arrogant of mind and heart. 52 He has thrown down the rulers from their thrones but lifted up the lowly. 53 The hungry he has filled with good things; the rich he has sent away empty. 54 He has helped Israel his servant, remembering his mercy, 55 according to his promise to our fathers, to Abraham and to his descendants forever." 56 Mary remained with her about three months and then returned to her home.
57 17 When the time arrived for Elizabeth to have her child she gave birth to a son. 58 Her neighbors and relatives heard that the Lord had shown his great mercy toward her, and they rejoiced with her. 59 18 When they came on the eighth day to circumcise the child, they were going to call him Zechariah after his father, 60 but his mother said in reply, "No. He will be called John." 61 But they answered her, "There is no one among your relatives who has this name." 62 So they made signs, asking his father what he wished him to be called. 63 He asked for a tablet and wrote, "John is his name," and all were amazed. 64 Immediately his mouth was opened, his tongue freed, and he spoke blessing God.
65 Then fear came upon all their neighbors, and all these matters were discussed throughout the hill country of Judea. 66 All who heard these things took them to heart, saying, "What, then, will this child be?" For surely the hand of the Lord was with him. 67 Then Zechariah his father, filled with the holy Spirit, prophesied, saying: 68 19 "Blessed be the Lord, the God of Israel, for he has visited and brought redemption to his people. 69 20 He has raised up a horn for our salvation within the house of David his servant, 70 even as he promised through the mouth of his holy prophets from of old: 71 salvation from our enemies and from the hand of all who hate us, 72 to show mercy to our fathers and to be mindful of his holy covenant 73 and of the oath he swore to Abraham our father, and to grant us that, 74 rescued from the hand of enemies, without fear we might worship him 75 in holiness and righteousness before him all our days. 76 And you, child, will be called prophet of the Most High, for you will go before the Lord 21 to prepare his ways, 77 to give his people knowledge of salvation through the forgiveness of their sins, 78 because of the tender mercy of our God by which the daybreak from on high 22 will visit us 79 to shine on those who sit in darkness and death's shadow, to guide our feet into the path of peace." 80 The child grew and became strong in spirit, and he was in the desert until the day of his manifestation to Israel.
Yup, pretty clueless, the whole bunch of them. When Joseph was visited by the angel, he was left clueless as well. Why don't Bible Believers (tm) have such a rough time of actually reading and understanding what is in the Bible?
“So, then it would be wrong, in your view, to offer our physical suffering to Christ as a gift to unite ourselves more fully to Him?”
Guess that depends on what you mean. Paul often looked at things like a soldier. Now, I deployed often enough that my first thought on hearing I was going to Base X was, “Food? Quarters? Showers?”
I was glad to deploy - to be part of the action and not a spectator - but I saw no value in suffering for suffering’s sake. Working long hours or getting up at 0130, or getting shot at...those went with the territory. But if the option existed, I preferred cots to the back of Humvees, or a decent bed to a cot. Note - they had mattresses in Afghanistan that were so hard that many preferred cots!
So if I needed to suffer for the mission, OK. Practice bleeding was NOT OK.
Second, suffering doesn’t automatically unite us with Christ and it does nothing for the atonement of others - in the sense of covering their sins. To the extent that spreading the Gospel makes it possible for others to hear the Gospel, yes. But it has zero to do with paying their debt, so to speak. The debt was paid in full by Christ.
“You know I’ll dispute the significance of the past tense.”
Dispute away! But I thought PROTESTANTS were the ones ignoring scripture for doctrine!
Just as I think it significant that scripture never says, “For God so loved the elect...”, I think it significant that we never find, “You may be justified” or “You might be justified”.
“He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.”
“Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth. Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?...Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.” - Romans 8
Forgive the KJV-fetish...it usually passes after a couple of days.
That’s actually modelled on how I looked when I was an Episcopalian. Except I had WAY better hair. And my cassock fastened to the side, not down the middle.
No wonder the bible doesn't have a (third) leg to stand on...The apostle Paul didn't even bother to tell us about the 'neck'...Who can believe that guy...
BWAAAAAHAAAAAHAAHAHAHA!!!
Lumen gentium speaks of her as taking care of all her children. We are extremely numerous, but yet not infinite in number. Therefore, we are not too numerous for her to see and care for. For her capacity for that infinite vision of God is in proportion to her love on earth, so great that Pius IX, as we saw, said it was so great that “none greater under God can be thought of, and no one but God can comprehend it.”
No one can understand it??? That's the understatement of the century...
Unbelievable...You guys fabricate this goofy story and normal, average people believe it...WoW...
You have never seen the 'original' Greek of the NT...
Dispute away! But I thought PROTESTANTS were the ones ignoring scripture for doctrine!
I said significance. I'm not for changing the text or for pulling some weird translation out of my, um, lexicon.
Look at the tenses in the Romans passage. I think one has to have a gentle hand on the bridle when working NT rhetoric and diction -- and tense would be part of that.
Seriously, this is important. I don't LIKE premature cloture on a conversation and interpretation, etc. It's a characteristic of co-dependency to have the table tidied up and the dishes washed and put away even before people are done eating their supper.
So to me that means Paul's usage means that in SOME respects its "perfect" tense. Completed, done, finished. In other respects MAYBE it's going on, it's in process, present progressive or imperfect. And clearly in terms of the big picture he talks about a consummation in the future.
Even in Paul's Eucharistic theology we look back to Christ's death and ahead to when he comes again.
So I think I am responsible to the entire Pauline corpus when I want to check at too rigid and simple an insistence on the meaning of the tense in one verse.
So, in other words, to meet with the approval of John Leland (a/k/a Jefferson's head cheese man)(Gotta love that anonymous screen name), Catholics should not respond to calumny, since such a response would indicate weakness.
Check.
(Sounds like the same logic Howard Dean used in saying that the election of Scott Brown was a unambiguous indication that Obamacare wasn't liberal enough)
;-)
Belloc is well known for rejecting the parliamentary form of governance and proposing instead distributism which I believe is not quite theocratic and not quite socialism but clearly anti-capitalism. Distributism is a return to a medieval economy. It rests on the principle of subsidiarity which raises anew Pope Benedict's last encyclical.
Personally, I believe the issues should be aired but that it should be a philosophical/political/theological discussion on a new thread, something that would attract a lot of posters who are not interested in the same old debate points. Truly, it would make for a great ecumenical discussion.
If you'd care to repost it that way, dear stfassisi, I'd love to follow along!
Two times...Once with lacking, once with behind...
What the Protestant "Analogy of Faith" means on the ground is that some guys in robes get to decide what the MAIN meaning of the MAIN scriptures are. Then they appear to mistranslate this passage because the plain sense of the Greek does not comport with what they think the main meanings are.
Nonsense...You are spending too much time on your Catholic theology and not enough time in the scriptures...
Col 1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:
Paul wasn't lacking in afflictions of Christ in his flesh...Paul had plenty of afflictions...But he said he was behind, NOT completely lacking...
The KJV translators knew this...I know this...Somehow, you missed the boat...
The word used for lacking is also legitimate in the use of behind...It was translated correctly...
MARY'S SACRIFICE ...Whenever we think of Our Lady as the Co-Redemptress in Salvation, our minds usually wander back to the moment of the Annunciation, when the Archangel Gabriel delivered God's message to a young woman. God's plan of salvation was put into action when she said yes. Be it done to me according to Thy Word. But beyond the conception and birth of Christ, Our Mother also served as Co-Redemptress at the foot of the cross. I can only imagine the grief that Our Lady suffered. To live your whole life taking care of your only son, devoting all your waking moments to that one child, only to have him wrenched away from you. Yet in the end, she denied nothing from God. She gave Him all she had. Her Son. And just like in the Annunciation, Mary replied with a "Yes" in Calvary, and the whole world was redeemed by the sacrifice of Christ's body and blood.
The Legion of Mary is an Association of Catholics who, with the sanction of the Church and under the powerful leadership of Mary Immaculate, Mediatrix of all Graces (who is fair as the moon, bright as the sun, and - to satan and his legionaries - terrible as an army set in battle array), have formed themselves into a Legion for service in the warfare which is perpetually waged by the Church against the world and its evil powers. - I am all Yours my Queen and my Mother and all that I have is Yours!
"For as truly as she suffered and almost died with her suffering Son" - these are the words of Pope Benedict XV -"so truly did she renounce her maternal rights over that Son for the sake of our salvation, and (did she) immolate him, as far as with her lay, to placate God's justice. Hence it may justly be said that with Christ she redeemed the human race."
Mary gave her son? Mary redeemed? Mary mediated? Mary nearly died? Mary immolated Christ? Mary sacrificed? Mary put God's plan of salvation into action when she said yes? Mary placated God's justice?
Do these people ever read the Bible? Do they not know or not care they are speaking terrible lies against God and prurient vanity for which they will be held accountable?
And to think they teach this to their children is the saddest thing of all.
You're right about the warning...But you'd better look a little more closely...
Paul was teaching and referring to the Gospel of the Grace of God...Grace thru Faith without works of any kind, lest you might boast...
Uh, I think he was talking about your religion...Does the shoe fit???
Hey, if you ever meet any of those intellectuals, tell 'em I said hi...And tell them I'd like to lead them away from their false sense of widsom and lead them to Jesus Christ...
Exactly...The staggering number of prayers God never heard...
Please show me where Saint Paul said without works of any kind.
Does your redacted Bible still include Matthew 25:31-46?
Dr.E: Amen! Basic Christianity beautifully testified to in your post.
Thank you. It seems to me this basic understanding puts to shame the idea that Jesus had to come to us in a perfect sinless vessel.
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