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Who are the Catholics: The Orthodox or The Romanists, or both?
Me
Posted on 01/05/2010 9:46:47 PM PST by the_conscience
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To: Forest Keeper
...a Catholic will turn to "the Saint for that" fully thinking that the prayer by the Saint on his/her behalf will carry greater weight with God than his/her own prayer...Really?
1,561
posted on
01/10/2010 9:30:42 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Cronos
1,562
posted on
01/10/2010 9:31:05 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Dr. Eckleburg; Natural Law; Mad Dawg
And, repeating ad nauseum, in The Church, we don’t pray TO an image. We believe the image, the statue etc. to be just inanimate pieces of wood, stone, clay. They are not God
1,563
posted on
01/10/2010 9:31:36 PM PST
by
Cronos
(Philipp2:12, 2Cor5:10, Rom2:6, Matt7:21, Matt22:14, Lu12:42-46,John15:1-10,Rev2:4-5,Rev22:19)
To: 1000 silverlings; UriÂ’el-2012
Well some of those Psalms are off by a year if thats true
Why do you say that? Uri pointed out the links between the psalm numbers and the dates
1,564
posted on
01/10/2010 9:32:30 PM PST
by
Cronos
(Philipp2:12, 2Cor5:10, Rom2:6, Matt7:21, Matt22:14, Lu12:42-46,John15:1-10,Rev2:4-5,Rev22:19)
To: Forest Keeper
HOWEVER, :), it IS my understanding that on certain subjects a Catholic will turn to "the Saint for that" fully thinking that the prayer by the Saint on his/her behalf will carry greater weight with God than his/her own prayer. If that is true then I would call that preferring a middleman. WHICH, of course, is exceedingly logical and wholesale true to the evidence presented to us hereon.
OH, RIGHT . . . at least the rabid Vatican et al cliques hereon gave up logic . . .
--for lent
--for Christmas
--for New Year's
--for President's Day --for Sunday
--for Wednesday
--for weekends
--for ummpteen feast days
--for umpteen 'saints' birthdays
--for most days in between the above
. . .
. . .
/s
1,565
posted on
01/10/2010 9:32:54 PM PST
by
Quix
(POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
To: Cronos
1,566
posted on
01/10/2010 9:34:07 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Petronski; Dr. Eckleburg; boatbums; Forest Keeper; HarleyD; Iscool; Gamecock
. . . It seems logical . . . to most of us . . . who did NOT give up logic for lent . . .
that
IF one felt that one’s own prayers directly were equal to or more efficacious than the prayers to/through a ‘saint,’
that one would forego bothering the ‘saint’
and just pray directly.
But then, as I note, that would be . . . for those who still have a firm grasp of logic.
Perhaps . . . unless one wanted to GRACE THE SAINT with one’s own magnanimous overpowering saintliness in making such a request . . . and thereby somehow benefit the ‘saint.’ LOL.
1,567
posted on
01/10/2010 9:38:08 PM PST
by
Quix
(POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
To: Petronski; Dr. Eckleburg
So you never ask anyone to pray for you, nor do you pray for anyone who asks it of you, right?
No, of course not -- a good Calvinist would say that the Calvinist god has already decided if say, Petronski goes to heaven, Dr. E and Cronos to heck. So, if Dr. E or I pray for you, there's no use, because it's already written that you're going up there. And there's no use for you to pray for us since Calvingod already decided before we were born that no matter how good or bad we were, we're going to get punished in heck.
your prayers can't save us or save you according to Calvingod.
And, our prayers for us or others, according to Calvingod, can't save us or anyone, we can't change what's already written. Even Calvingod is bound by what he wrote.
So, since Calvingod already decided that Petronski is going to heaven and is one of the "elect", you can do whatever you like and not pray, since you're one of the elites, one of the "elect", the upper caste, the Brahmins and the rest of us poor schmucks according to Calvingod are shudras, untouchables.
1,568
posted on
01/10/2010 9:38:11 PM PST
by
Cronos
(Philipp2:12, 2Cor5:10, Rom2:6, Matt7:21, Matt22:14, Lu12:42-46,John15:1-10,Rev2:4-5,Rev22:19)
To: Quix
IF one felt that ones own prayers directly were equal to or more efficacious than the prayers to/through a saint, that one would forego bothering the saint and just pray directly.So then you don't bother asking anyone to pray for you. Why bother, right?
1,569
posted on
01/10/2010 9:40:56 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Cronos
You've asked this same question a half-dozewn times and you've gotten the same answer each time.
God did not tell the Jews to pray to anyone other than Him. Not to the serpent, the cherubim or any graven image.
Is any of this getting through? The error of Rome is that it teaches men to pray to someone other than God.
"Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God." -- Philippeans 4:6
"Unto God." Period.
1,570
posted on
01/10/2010 9:41:19 PM PST
by
Dr. Eckleburg
("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
To: Quix
Lent begins February 17 this year.
1,571
posted on
01/10/2010 9:41:55 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Iscool; Mr Rogers
that which is behind That is a fantastical translation, another example of KJV lying through its reformist teeth.
Find another place where τα υστερηματα means "behind".
Liars.
When it doesn't suit their satanic bigotry, all of a sudden they learn what Greek means:
καταρτισαι τα υστερηματα της πιστεως υμων
Or in English, "might perfect that which is behind in your faith?"
NOT. KJV says there, correcty, "which is lacking" (1 Thess 3:10).
Inflect the word enough and you will get meanings like "lastly":
υστερον επεινασεν -- he was afterwards hungry.
Never when a lack is indicated.
εκ της υστερησεως (Mk 12:44)
Of her behind she cast what she had?
Yeah, right.
The Protestant obfuscation of the gospel is really a shame.
1,572
posted on
01/10/2010 9:42:15 PM PST
by
annalex
(http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
To: Dr. Eckleburg
The error of Rome is that it teaches men to pray to someone other than God. So never ask anyone to pray for you. Period.
1,573
posted on
01/10/2010 9:42:36 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Petronski
Sometimes, it appears that you have not clue one about your own posts.
1,574
posted on
01/10/2010 9:43:18 PM PST
by
Quix
(POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
To: Quix
Your misperceptions are not my concern.
1,575
posted on
01/10/2010 9:43:54 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Cronos
It’s just that sick.
Nice summary.
1,576
posted on
01/10/2010 9:46:35 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: Petronski; esquirette
Faith without works is dead.
Dear me, Petronski, are you quoting James 2:20, "...that faith without works is dead." ?
Of course, this defines The Church and faith with positive actions, that we must have faith that our savior is Jesus Christ, but at the same time our actions reflect that faith. So, in a sense, positive, Godly, actions or deeds cannot alone get you into heaven, nor does faith alone as is says in James 2:26 that faith without works is dead and in Romans 3:22 we are saved by faith in Jesus Christ. Catholic theology supports these teachings of the Bible.
good works are done to glorify God and are done in honor of him.
Since the initiative belongs to God in the order of grace, no one can merit the initial grace of forgiveness and justification at the beginning of conversion,
1,577
posted on
01/10/2010 9:47:30 PM PST
by
Cronos
(Philipp2:12, 2Cor5:10, Rom2:6, Matt7:21, Matt22:14, Lu12:42-46,John15:1-10,Rev2:4-5,Rev22:19)
To: Forest Keeper
In order to be a heretic one has to be informed of the true faith, and then reject it. A Buddhist or, possibly, a Mormon is not a heretic, he is someone of a different faith. Protestants are heretics insofar as they understand and reject Catholicism. Since 20c Protestantism does not seem to even understand itself any more, I hesitate to apply the term to latter day Protestants. They are simply confused people, no comment on the present polite company.
1,578
posted on
01/10/2010 9:47:58 PM PST
by
annalex
(http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
To: Cronos
So, in a sense, positive, Godly, actions or deeds cannot alone get you into heaven, nor does faith alone as is says in James 2:26 that faith without works is dead and in Romans 3:22 we are saved by faith in Jesus Christ.That's it. You have identified the false dichotomy that must rank at or near the top of anti-Catholic lies. The question is not faith v. works, as each alone is insufficient.
Rather, faith and works are required.
1,579
posted on
01/10/2010 9:49:56 PM PST
by
Petronski
(In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
To: esquirette; Petronski
Salvation / Grace is by Christ. ONLY Christ's actions and sacrifice merited our salvation. We do not deserve any merit from our good works because without Gods Grace we can neither do it nor have the initiative to do it. When God rewards us for our good works, it is a gift from Him. Because our merit is Gods gift then it may come in the form of (increase of) Grace and even eternal life.
We don't do our good works for the pure purpose of winning salvation, we do it to glorify God. By Christ's death, He conquered death, and opened the possibility of salvation to ALL.He came to save us from sin, the curse and death by making us more readily believe this mystery, the Word of God teaches us of it, so much as we may be able to receive, by the comparison of Jesus Christ with Adam. Adam is by nature the head of all humanity, which is one with him by natural descent from him. Jesus Christ, in whom the Godhead is united with manhood, graciously made himself the new almighty Head of men, whom he unites to himself through faith. Therefore as in Adam we had fallen under sin, the curse, and death, so we are delivered from sin, the curse, and death in Jesus Christ. His voluntary suffering and death on the cross for us, being of infinite value and merit, as the death of one sinless, God and man in one person, is both a perfect satisfaction to the justice of God, which had condemned us for sin to death, and a fund of infinite merit, which has obtained him the right, without prejudice to justice, to give us sinners pardon of our sins, and grace to have victory over sin and death
1,580
posted on
01/10/2010 9:58:21 PM PST
by
Cronos
(Philipp2:12, 2Cor5:10, Rom2:6, Matt7:21, Matt22:14, Lu12:42-46,John15:1-10,Rev2:4-5,Rev22:19)
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