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To: Mr Rogers; Markos33; Iscool
When you understand that behaviors are genetically based, in many cases, then original sin becomes easier to understand.

No human behavior has been linked to genetics. Homosexuals have tried, but there simply is no evidence for that. All human behavior is learned. Some have better propensity to learning than others, but that has more to do with conditions leading to the birth and any damage incurred in the process.

If you take an infant, put him in the backyackrd, in a cage, give him food and water, never talk to him, never hug him, etc., you won't have a "human" being as we know it. He won't be able to speak a language, he will have none of the social graces, or qualities we consider "God-created" humanity. You will have a human beast. His human genes will do nothing to making him "civilized."

Logic is a tool with which you make a working model. The operant word here is working. It works. It makes no other pretenses. It does not bring in supernatural or spiritual. It simply takes what's at hand and makes it work. Is it universally true? Under the circumstances it operates, yes. That's why we know what it is is and understand how it works.

If I give you a math problem and you solve it, I can't assume to know how you did it, unless you tell me. With faith you can't to that because it's a "leap" (assumption) form the start and it's based on some experience we choose to interpret as providential.

Aristotle's physics were not real physics. They were speculative inferences without the necessary scientific method. He claimed that things fall on earth (i.e.gravity) because "things fall towards the center," implying that the earth was the center of the Universe.

Looking at the sky move around us, we can understand why he may have thought so. Ptolemy constructed a whole navigational system based on that geocentric system. It still works, from our earthly perspective, even if it is wrong. Science, unlike religion, makes no claim as to the absolute truth. It either works or doesn't. There is no guessing and there is no revelation, praying or faith involved.

Without logic, we have to depend, on chance. Now, let's see, which will I choose...do I get a job, save money and retire, or do I stick my hand out and wait for manna to fall from the sky? Good luck! You will need it!

What we do is based on logic, no matter how perfect or how flawed. We try not to do things we know will not work. So, there is always logic involved, no matter if it s driven by reason or emotion, how perfect or flawed it may be.

2,724 posted on 07/19/2009 9:27:07 AM PDT by kosta50 (Don't look up, the truth is all around you)
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To: kosta50

Humans live a long time, and we cannot control their breeding. We can and have with dogs, and have bred dogs to behave in certain ways. I had a Border Collie that was 5 when she had her first and only chance to work sheep. The sheep were just off the range and not used to dogs, so it was a tough challenge - but she gathered them up and drove them thru two gates into a far pasture with ZERO training.

The rancher - who expected her to fail - offered to buy her. I turned him down because she was our pet.

That was a complex series of behaviors executed by a dog that hadn’t seen sheep between 8 weeks and 5 years.

We are animals as well. Our bodies affect our minds, and our minds use multiple ways to solve problems. Logic is merely one, and it is completely unsuitable for some decisions. You cannot use logic to get across a room. Your mind uses the same processes, but it couldn’t process the information needed via conscious thought.


2,726 posted on 07/19/2009 9:50:34 AM PDT by Mr Rogers (I loathe the ground he slithers on!)
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