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To: bdeaner

Revelation 12:1-5, 17 refers to the Nation of Israel — which is made especially clear in 12:17.

And I think your leap of logic is a little faulty. If Jesus tells us to forgive our enemies, then you would naturally conclude that we are to forgive HIS enemies and not OUR enemies. Just as you conclude that we are to honor HIS parents and not OUR own.

Now, maybe you can make the point a little better — maybe. But the premises you laid out are a little faulty.

Now, I hold Mary with great respect. And once I fall on the ground and worship the Father and Son, I cannot wait to meet her and Joseph in heaven! And then I would love to spend a lot of time with the Apostle Paul.

But, if you are going to argue that she should be prayed to (or through) — then I find precious little in scripture that would account for that.

However, I am not Catholic — and personally, even if you could pray to Mary — I wouldn’t as the Father and Jesus are so much greater than Mary, that it wouldn’t even enter my mind to pray to her.


31 posted on 06/19/2009 8:34:26 AM PDT by rom (Obama '12 slogan: Let's keep on hopin'!)
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To: rom
...the Father and Jesus are so much greater than Mary, that it wouldn’t even enter my mind to pray to her.

So you never ask anyone to pray for you?

Remember, "pray" means "ask."

37 posted on 06/19/2009 8:48:14 AM PDT by Petronski (In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
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To: rom

We ask the dead to pray for us, and we pray for the dead, like Jesus did. (2 Macabees 12:45). If you ask your spiritually enlightened brother to pray for you, does that make him an intercessor at the level of Jesus? No, he is simply an intercessor who aspires to be like Jesus, and is doing what Jesus commanded.

God gave us a true role model in our Holy Mother and we love her for being God’s chosen. That doesn’t mean we love God any less. We know He comes first. Our love of anyone associated with Him, is a reflection of our love for Him. We don’t pray to Mary, we ask that she partake in our prayer. “Pray for us sinners now and in the hour of our death.” AMEN


95 posted on 06/20/2009 8:53:02 PM PDT by mgist
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