Sacramento Mormons invite African Americans on search for ancestors

The Sacramento Bee ^ | Mar. 15, 2009 | Robert Faturechi

[delacoert]

Ron McDowell clunks open a metal drawer, one of many at the Sacramento Family History Center, to reveal stacks and stacks of microfilm.

"Those are the census records from 1880," he said, pointing down the line of drawers. "They just go on and on."

[delacoert]

Let’s get back to the topic of baptism. Let’s see a statement from each one of those denominations...

OK

Statement of the Presbyterian Church (USA):
It is the practice of the Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) to receive on profession of faith those coming directly from a Mormon background and to administer baptism.

i.e., the Presbyterian Church does not accept the profession of faith from a Mormon. Mormon baptism and salvation are rejected by the Presbyterian Church and a new profession is required.

That's two for two.

[delacoert]

Let’s get back to the topic of baptism. Let’s see a statement from each one of those denominations...

OK

Statement of the Roman Catholic Church:
RESPONSE TO A 'DUBIUM'
on the validity of baptism conferred by
«The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints», called «Mormons»

Question: Whether the baptism conferred by the community «The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints», called «Mormons» in the vernacular, is valid.

Response: Negative.

Mormon baptism and salvation are rejected by the Roman Catholic Church.

There seems to be a pattern developing here.

[delacoert]

Let’s get back to the topic of baptism. Let’s see a statement from each one of those denominations...

OK

Statement of the United Methodist Church:
Therefore, while our denomination must continue to seek further clarity on issues of our own faith, we have enough clarity to take steps toward establishing a policy for the United Methodist Church regarding the reception of those converting from the LDS Church. It is our recommendation that following a period of catechesis (a time of intensive exploration and instruction in the Christian faith), such a convert should receive the sacrament of Christian baptism.

Once again, Mormon baptism and salvation are rejected. This time by the Methodist Church.

Holy molely Batman! There can't be this sort of agree amongst religions denominations, can there?

[delacoert]

Let’s get back to the topic of baptism. Let’s see a statement from each one of those denominations...

OK

Statement of the Assemblies of God Church :
Mormonism, throughout its 170-year history, has always found itself toe-to-toe with the larger body of Christian believers. Today, the Mormon Church fields some 60,000 missionaries whose job it is to bring people into membership — to baptize them not merely into Christ, but into Mormonism. That is why most evangelical denominations are on record denouncing the doctrines of Mormonism. The late Walter Martin, the father of the modern anti-cult movement, called Mormonism a collection of "garbled doctrines masquerading as Christianity."

Those are strong words. Christians do not make such statements out of rancor, jealousy or ill will. They are simply facing up to their responsibility to challenge Mormonism’s erroneous doctrines. They do so because this religion teaches false ideas about the nature of God and man and about the way of salvation.

Alas. Rejected by the Assemblies of God.

Wait! wait! The Baptists! The Baptists! Next to the Presbyterians, they're the Mormon's best friend!

[Osage Orange]

who are all candidates for necro-dunking...

Right...but so wrong.

Ugh!

[spamlds]

Again, you’re evading the point. The four questions on baptism are:

1. Is baptism essential to salvation?
2. Who can perform baptism?
3. How is baptism to be performed.
4. At what age is baptism a requirement.

None of your cut-and-paste answers address these fundamental questions. The denominations in question have different answers to them. There is no unity among Christian sects. Some say it is essential to be baptized while others say it isn’t. Some say sprinkling is OK while others say that immersion is the only proper biblical way to baptize. Some baptize infants. As is the case with the other sacraments, there is no agreement among them, yet all of them use the Bible for their guide.

My point is that tolerance would allow for disagreement without rancor. To target Mormons when Christians are unable to come to a unity of the faith is religious bigotry. Anti-Mormonism is intolerance.

[Godzilla]

My point is that tolerance would allow for disagreement without rancor. To target Mormons when Christians are unable to come to a unity of the faith is religious bigotry. Anti-Mormonism is intolerance.

Well n00b, we have seen the tolerance directed by your prophets over the years towards Christianity. If you want citations from then, I'd be pleased to present them - but then I'm sure you are already aware of them - as they are parroted daily by your missionaries door-to-door. By you own definition - your missionaries are anti-Christian bigots every day.

Your second erroneous opinion is that we are to be tolerant of mormon teachings as if they are on equal footing with the rest of Christianity. Not even close by any stretch of the imagination.

There is no unity among many things in mormon sects - yes you have them, what makes LDS superior to FLDS or RLDS or the many xLDS sects out there?

The bom does not contain any instruction on baptism for the dead, in fact it can be found to speak against that practice.

[spamlds]

Read my profile, Godzilla. I’ve been on FR since 2004, but I had the mods delete my account in protest of the anti-Mormon trash on FR. Well, I decided to come back and fight the good fight. Besides, I always thought that the idea that new people in a forum have as many rights as anyone else. Good ideas are good, whether a person has been here for a day or for years.

I’m guessing that you really don’t appreciate how offensive your personal display of intolerance are to reasonable people, so I’ll overlook it. I’m not here to debate with sectarian Christians. Frankly, that’s pointless. There are so many internal conflicts among their own ranks and so many doctrinal disagreements that it’s impossible for you guys to put up a unified argument. Once you resolve the disunity and set your own house in order, maybe there will be time for reasonable discussion.

I wouldn’t consider our missionary efforts to be a display of intolerance. We are commissioned to lift up a warning voice. If a tornado was about to strike your neighborhood, wouldn’t you warn others? Modern revelation has given us the information people need to prepare for the calamities that will occur in the last days. If you choose to ignore the message and encourage others do do so, that’s OK. Nevertheless, it is our neighborly duty to warn others. A lot of people ignored Noah’s warning. “As it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be in the coming of the Son of Man.”

My purpose here is not to proselyte, but instead to highlight and document anti-Mormon activity for www.spamlds.org. If you wish to bash Mormons, go ahead. You’re just giving me more material.

[colorcountry]

LOL

Is it your “mission?”

[spamlds]

No, the term “mission” might imply that I’m acting under some authority other than my own interest. I’m simply doing research. Thank you all for your participation.

[colorcountry]

Well, it is my mission (and I AM implying that I am acting under the authority of Christ). That I expose the lies and absurdities of the LDS Church.

John 8:32
Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

So if the son has set you free you will be free indeed.
John 8:36

[Godzilla]

Read my profile

Actually wasted time and read your society page

I’m guessing that you really don’t appreciate how offensive your personal display of intolerance are to reasonable people, so I’ll overlook it. I’m not here to debate with sectarian Christians.

Oh, so your personal display of intolerance is OK? Lots of intolerant comments and phots on your little society page spammer. LOL, pot meet kettle.

There are so many internal conflicts among their own ranks and so many doctrinal disagreements that it’s impossible for you guys to put up a unified argument.

Sorry, doesn't wash here outside of your echo chamber. I feel sorry for you that you believe your doctrines are incapable of standing up to examination and must duck the issues.

I wouldn’t consider our missionary efforts to be a display of intolerance.

LOL, ok having your missionaries going door to door and saying that all Christianity is apostate and of the devil isn't apostate . . . . wait, that is what you are accusing us of doing here. Right, I get it - clintonesque. LOL, your modern revelations - what has been the latest. . . changing the temple ceremony in 1990? Blacks being allowed the priesthood 1978? Has your prophet finally gotten the translation of the boa figured out yet?

[spamlds]

The last post is a classic anti-Mormon “shotgun attack,” which throws more confusing questions that time or the venue will permit addressing with reasonable detail. It’s intended to throw up a smokescreen of doubt. That’s because the points are thrown out there with no intention of listening to the answers.

The answers to all of those questions you posed are to be found on my web site (www.spamlds.org) for any open-minded person to read at their leisure. There’s no need to rehash them here in FR.

[Godzilla]

The answers to all of those questions you posed are to be found on my web site (www.spamlds.org) for any open-minded person to read at their leisure. There’s no need to rehash them here in FR.

Your last post is a classical mormon duck and cover, since you do not want to acknowledge the fact that your site and materials posted at your society page are an equally offensive. As far as the rest of the items, if you are going to poke around here with your apologetic, you better be ready to defend it here and not on a common blog, because here you have to ramp your game up. But that shouldn't bother you, you have all your answers pre-cooked for cut and paste.

[delacoert]

The last post is a classic anti-Mormon “shotgun attack,” which throws more confusing questions that time or the venue will permit addressing with reasonable detail.

Nonsense.

Every statement was a response to a quoted item that you wrote.

[Old Mountain man]

I also noticed that none of the usual anti-mormons could post their methods of baptism for their own religions. Sad, isn’t it? These folks always dodge legitimate questions with their little shotgun attacks and bogus posts.

[Old Mountain man]

Except that in a typical tactic, you dodged the direct questions raised and put up smokescreens.

[Godzilla]

Every statement was a response to a quoted item that you wrote.

I know, credability already hitting zero because of the duck and run.

[colorcountry]

If baptism (a work) was necessary in order for a person to be saved, this could be a debatable subject. However, Ephesians 2:8,9 clearly states that we are saved by grace through faith, not works such as baptism. Baptism is merely an outside sign of an inner work of the Holy Spirit in an individual’s life. Believers should be baptized as a testimony of their faith in Christ; however, baptism does not save.

[Old Mountain man]

Prayer is a work. How are you saved without prayer?