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To: big'ol_freeper
There is not one person who has ever lived that the Catholic Church (or practicing Catholics) states is in hell or destined for hell.

That may well be the official line from the Vatican, however, since the days of Martin Luther, PLENTY of practicing Roman Catholics, as well as Curia speaking for the Roman Church itself, have stated certain Protestants (like Luther) or all Protestants (who believe in sola fide) as it says in Trent, are accursed (anathema)--which meant, in the language of the 16th Century, in Hell.

The idea that the Roman Church has (always) been as tolerant and open minded as it is today is laughable, to any fair-minded student of history.

355 posted on 07/27/2008 12:50:25 PM PDT by AnalogReigns
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To: AnalogReigns
The idea that the Roman Church has (always) been as tolerant and open minded as it is today

Please see Annalex's posts on this thread, particularly POST 312.

Annalex has told us all that if a Protestant willingly and knowingly denies Rome's "Marian dogma" he will go to hell. Period.

Trent is still in effect. When and if Rome wants to become "tolerant" it can abolish the anathemas still over the heads of all Bible-believing Christians.

361 posted on 07/27/2008 1:06:09 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: AnalogReigns; big'ol_freeper

Anathemata refer to doctrines, not to people.

Certain doctrines, for example, those invented by Luther, indeed are, and always will be, anathema. That means that an informed freely undertaken belief in them is a grave sin and if unrepented, leads to Hell.

But the rub is in this “informed”, “freely undertaken”, and “unrepented”. Anyone can repent and convert in his heart, — therefore we cannot say if Luther is himself in hell. There is this anecdote: someone is mourning his relative who committed suicide by jumping off a bridge. Yet the priest explained to him: do not presume that he is in hell on the account of that mortal sin. There was plenty of time after the feet left the railings and the head hit the water.

Further, one may grow into a non-Catholic environment and in his most ardent desire to unite to Christ have false beliefs inculcated in him by his community of faith. That is not then an informed decision of free will: he was mislead by his pastor and parents. Such man will be judged on his works but not on the imperfections of his belief. Or one may be unaware that the doctrine was anathemized and be in a sincere error. There are many exculpatory scenarios depending on one’s culture, personal history, and education. This is why we never presume damnation, and we only proclaim factual salvation of canonized saints. All we do is point out false doctrines.


366 posted on 07/27/2008 1:10:19 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: AnalogReigns

The idea that the Roman Church has (always) been as tolerant and open minded as it is today is laughable, to any fair-minded student of history.

= = =

Indeed.

However, of course, the magicsterical has managed to implement RUBBER HISTORY 200.8 . . . which makes all such errors obsolete and quite dodge-able.


394 posted on 07/27/2008 1:24:41 PM PDT by Quix (key QUOTES POLS 1900 ON #76 http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2031425/posts?page=77#77)
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