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To: Judith Anne; Alex Murphy; alpha-8-25-02; blue-duncan; Dr. Eckleburg; ears_to_hear; Forest Keeper; ..

I think that’s seriously misreading what the Protty’s saying.

Trusting that God said what He meant and meant what He said in the Scriptures related to the issue is a relatively simple issue.

The Scripture says we can know that we are Saved.

Disbelieving God’s Word is a LOT more hazardous than taking God at His Word and believing Him emphatically.


4,785 posted on 06/11/2008 7:43:58 AM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix; Judith Anne
Judith Anne at 4721: God will judge the protestants who set themselves up as judges of how others love and serve Him. Of that, I am certain.

Quix at 4785: Disbelieving God’s Word is a LOT more hazardous than taking God at His Word and believing Him emphatically.

Judging other people – no matter who is doing the judging – is hazardous indeed. God will use our own measures in judging us:

Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. - Matthew 7:1-2

And we will be found guilty:

Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. – Romans 2:1

We should remember that thinking a thing is tantamount to actually doing it:

Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. – Matthew 5:27-28

And so, even having a judgmental thought about another person should bring us to our Spiritual “knees” in repentance.

Instead, we are responsible for judging “matters.” We Christians should never turn such issues over to secular authorities. And we Christians are only right-minded when we bear the personal damages and injuries.

Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?

Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren? But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers. Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? why do ye not rather [suffer yourselves to] be defrauded? Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that [your] brethren. - I Corinthians 6:1-8

Even then, our judgment of matters must be blind:

Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: [but] in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour. – Leviticus 19:15

Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. – John 7:24

There are two instances where we are to judge persons. And both of them are to protect the Church. The first is how to identify a false prophet so that we will know to ignore him.

Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither [can] a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. - Matthew 7:15-18

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. - Galatians 5:22-23

If we do not see those fruits in the Spirit in the speaker, we must ignore him. That is not a carte blanche to punish him for what he said.

But the other does involve punishment, and that is to banish an evil doer from the mortal fellowship of the Church.

It is reported commonly [that there is] fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, [concerning] him that hath so done this deed, In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Your glorying [is] not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?... For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person. – I Corinthians 5:1-13

This is a solemn and extremely hazardous responsibility because the measure used on the evil doer will be used on the ones passing judgment on him.

So, dear brother in Christ, I very strongly agree with you. The most important thing we have to do (the one and only Great Commandment – Matt 22) is to love God surpassingly above all else. If we do that, we will believe Him and we will trust Him.

And so, dear sister in Christ, I also very strongly agree with you. God will judge all of us (regardless of the label we wear) and He will use our own measures to do it.

To God be the glory!

4,815 posted on 06/11/2008 8:37:22 AM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Quix
The Scripture says we can know that we are Saved.

10-4

BUT do the Scriptures say if we don't know it we're not saved?

Or, in a more global level of querying: Can there be a "bad Christian"? We'd say, yes.

4,855 posted on 06/11/2008 10:05:31 AM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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