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To: Antoninus; All
My wife is Catholic, and I consider myself a non-denominational Protestant, though I was raised Southern Baptist. I have attended Mass with my wife and her family for the past several years (since before we were married) as my own family had more of a Easter/ Christmas deal.

When we pray to her, we ask for her to interceed on our behalf with her Son, Jesus. I have always found it odd that Protestants would ask other living men to pray for them, but neglect to ask those who are alive in Heaven to do likewise. There's just something deeply wrong there.

This is an interesting statement. My understanding is that the dead are dead until the Resurrection. How then can there be anyone in heaven other than the Father and Christ my Redeamer? How could any of the dead pray for me? This has been one of my central issues with the Church. All of the Saints I'm to ask for help, and even Mary herself are dead unless they were bodily assumed into heaven (which I don't see any proof of). As such, of course we would ask family and friends for their prayers.

The above isn't in topic with the thread, so I'll add one that is. In your above statement, I've bolded something that, to me, contradicts (or at least undermines) Christ's role as Redeamer and Intercessor to the Father. It's as though Catholics are adding an unneeded step into the mix. Would one need to eventually ask a Saint to ask Mary to pray to Jesus for me? Please note I mean no disrespect, it's an honest question.

25 posted on 05/30/2008 11:01:40 AM PDT by EarthBound (Ex Deo,gratia. Ex astris,scientia (Who the hell do I vote for now?))
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To: EarthBound
It's as though Catholics are adding an unneeded step into the mix. Would one need to eventually ask a Saint to ask Mary to pray to Jesus for me? Please note I mean no disrespect, it's an honest question.

Rather than reinvent the wheel, check the following link which explains the matter much more clearly than I could off the cuff:

Praying to the Saints
32 posted on 05/30/2008 11:08:24 AM PDT by Antoninus (John 6:54)
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To: EarthBound
My understanding is that the dead are dead until the Resurrection. How then can there be anyone in heaven other than the Father and Christ my Redeamer? How could any of the dead pray for me?

Heaven is not in time, as we are while on earth.

God created time and He stands outside of it. Those with Him in Heaven are similarly situated.

79 posted on 05/30/2008 11:44:50 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: EarthBound

Post-death circumstances have always been a point of disagreement.

I believe the scriptures teach that the spirit of those who die in salvation are in Heaven immediately, and their bodies rise at the last day.

Before Jesus’ death, the spirit of those who were saved were in Hades, waiting for Jesus to lead the captives out of captivity and into heaven.

I have no opinion as to those who were “taken up”, I figure we’ll all know for certain when we get there.

Of course, I don’t pray to the spirit of the dead, but if I were going to do so, I’d pray to one that I knew from life, not somebody that some church labeled a “Saint”.

At least, that’s what I think I’d do, it’s hard to know since I would never think to pray to the spirit of the dead, just as I would never think to listen to the dead.


100 posted on 05/30/2008 12:01:53 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: EarthBound
Jesus said to his disciples: Mt 7:21-27 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name? Did we not drive out demons in your name? Did we not do mighty deeds in your name?’ Then I will declare to them solemnly, ‘I never knew you. Depart from me, you evildoers.’

Catholics perceive Heaven to be filled with angles and saints. We don't see God all alone like the Maytag repair man. "My house has many mansions". In any case, we ask all heavenly creatures who are with God, to pray for us and help us. We ask our living friends to pray for us too. Some Catholics practice these traditions, others don't. In my spiritual journey, the Blessed Mother, has personally helped and brought me closer to Jesus. She continues to help me understand "the will of God". Afterall, she is the perfect example of a human doing God's will. I have the deepest admiration, gratitude, and honor of her. She is the ultimate angel. I believe that because we are sinners, we can easily lose our way. The enemy clearly misguides us whenever possible. The bible shows how God's angels have served him throughout human history. Why is it different today?

I think for both Catholics and Protestants it is most important that we maintain the spirit of the law, which is love. As an adult, I choose to be Catholic, and can proudly say I have never heard a Catholic priest slander other religions or groups of people. For me that would be un-Christian.

226 posted on 05/31/2008 3:42:44 AM PDT by mgist
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To: EarthBound

Exactly. Thank you.


548 posted on 06/01/2008 3:28:07 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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