Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.
There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.
Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).
Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.
Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.
I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.
But do I WORSHIP them?
No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.
There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?
I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.
Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.
In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.
At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.
Ever been on O’Reilly’s No Spin Zone?
Marysecretary; What is that that entitles you to determine who is saved or not? Who gives you these great powers of universal knowledge? What compels you to you to insult others, who love God, like you do, just differently? Realize that those slandering the Pope are referencing their slanderous quotes of the Pope with links to posts in Freerepublic. From my perspective, the Taliban who denounce a country, are less wrong than those who denounce and slander believers in God. My reverence for God would not allow me to do that. Humility, which God asks of us, and fear for my soul, would not allow me to pretend that I am God to determine who is saved or not. I just don’t understand that mentality. I completely understand that you don’t agree with Catholicism, but you take it to a level that is sad. Our God is love and compassion. You are distorting His image.
Nah, they’re made up of commun-ists.
(they) "...have by no means been deprived of significance and importance in the mystery of salvation."
How significant? What level of importance?
No double talk. Give us the straight talk version.
Really? What was that?
She’s right where she belongs. It’s where God has placed her. Her knowledge is astounding, like some Catholic freepers, but I believe she already HAS the peace of Christ without being a part of the ‘one true church.’ (Actually, she IS part of the one true church—the Body of Christ.)
May we all come to really know, feel, and understand God’s love. Come Holy Spirit and fill the hearts of your faithfull.
It's tough to discuss theology with RC's because any criticism is more often then not viewed as an attack on their faith. It has been explained to me, by RC's, that they view support of their church as support of their faith. So when your Pope makes a stupid comment, calling Christians defective, and is criticized for it the attack dogs come out and claim that their church is being smeared by those that say the Pope said something stupid.
IIRC, the only ones who got upset were the Christians who believed in ecumenism. I didn't get upset because it was just a stupid comment from a guy that I don't associate with.
Scriptural errors such as sola scriptura and sola fide.
Tacky and Gross
Didn't happen.
Whew, that IS a relief.
Mary reads the Bible and believes the words of Jesus Christ.
"Be not afraid; only believe." -- Mark 5:36
Agreed. The errors of Calvinism lead to some whoppers.
I really wish God never gave us free will. Or at least I wish I had just enough free will to ask God to take it away from me.
No, because the minute any of us walked into it, it would be defective. (Because we aren’t exactly perfect.)
Reads? Believes?
Marysecretary told me Mary is dead.
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