The Worship of Mary? (An Observation)

[fortheDeclaration]

Fourteen translations of the Bible that refuse to translate blasphemeo as "blaspheme" are preferable, yet the Catholic translation that renders blasphemeo as **gasp** "blaspheme" is somehow wrong.

I still have no idea what you are talking about.

I do think that the Douay-Rheims got 1Cor.1:18 correct in translating save as 'saved' not 'being saved', but ofcourse, you just reject that as quickly as you do any Bible that doesn't line up with your Church's theology.

[fortheDeclaration]

Nobody has EVER suggested that the Blessed Virgin Mary was "perfect" and I challenge you to show otherwise.

508 From among the descendants of Eve, God chose the Virgin Mary to be the mother of his Son. "Full of grace", Mary is "the most excellent fruit of redemption" (SC 103): from the first instant of her conception, she was totally preserved from the stain of original sin and she remained pure from all personal sin throughout her life. (emphasis added)

http://www.christusrex.org/www1/CDHN/creed3.html#MARY

Challenge met.

[LordBridey]

Fact or Fiction, Mary was a sinner?

What difference does it make? Fact or fiction, believing the fact or the fiction has no consequence to salvation does it? Would believing McCain or Obama to be the best choice for president have any bearing on one's salvation? What is your point?

[Petronski]

No way. Your church is the church Constantine founded.

You're mistaken. I'm Catholic, a member of Christ's Church, the one Christ Founded.

[Petronski]

The other aspects follow later, to where she is actually involved in the salvation process-is she not?

According to who? You?

[fortheDeclaration]

[The other aspects follow later, to where she is actually involved in the salvation process-is she not?]

According to who? You?

According to your religion.

This union of the Mother and the Son in the work of redemption[57] reaches its climax on Calvary, where Christ "offered himself as the perfect sacrifice to God" (Heb. 9:14) and where Mary stood by the cross (cf. Jn. 19:25), "suffering grievously with her only-begotten Son. There she united herself with a maternal heart to His sacrifice, and lovingly consented to the immolation of this victim which she herself had brought forth" http://www.newadvent.org/library/docs_pa06mc.htm

[fortheDeclaration]

[Fact or Fiction, Mary was a sinner?]

What difference does it make? Fact or fiction, believing the fact or the fiction has no consequence to salvation does it? Would believing McCain or Obama to be the best choice for president have any bearing on one's salvation? What is your point?

I asked a simple question, was Mary a sinner or not.

So, what is your point in not answering the question?

It does affect salvation if one is looking to Mary for anything, when one ought to be looking to Christ for EVERYTHING.

Amazing how Roman Catholics on these threads avoid actually stating what their Church actually teaches!

[fortheDeclaration]

You're mistaken. I'm Catholic, a member of Christ's Church, the one Christ Founded.

The 'Christ' of 2Cor.11:4.

[Petronski]

You really don’t understand the distinction being drawn, do you?

[Petronski]

That verse is about your faith, your fall.

There is Jesus Christ and the Catholic Church, which He founded and which is guided by the Holy Spirit; and then there are those who came along later preaching a different christ, making up sola scriptura and sola fide, deceiving hundreds of millions of souls.

[RexBeach]

Thanks for your thoughts.

I pray to God and Christ every day...and the saints.

There is nothing wrong with it, and I am not making up my own religion.

God bless,

Rex

[OpusatFR]

“According to your religion.

This union of the Mother and the Son in the work of redemption[57] reaches its climax on Calvary, where Christ “offered himself as the perfect sacrifice to God” (Heb. 9:14) and where Mary stood by the cross (cf. Jn. 19:25), “suffering grievously with her only-begotten Son. There she united herself with a maternal heart to His sacrifice, and lovingly consented to the immolation of this victim which she herself had brought forth” http://www.newadvent.org/library/docs_pa06mc.htm";

She bowed to God’s Will which is more and better than I would have done as a mother if my son had been tortured.

The spear would have been in my hand and in someone’s chest.

You, as people do on these threads, distort our beliefs.

But then again, Calvinists can’t believe Mary could possibly consent to anything other than an Almighty abrogation of her body.

[MarkBsnr]

***Men are not good and therefore men believe.***

Huh? Believe in what? I thought that you guys claim that unregenerated men do not believe.

***Men are fallen and incapable of belief unless God first grabs hold of them and drags them to Him, imputing to them the righteousness of Christ in place of their own fleshly nature.***

The hijacking Reformed Holy Spirit. And the elect are those who experience Stockholm Syndrome.

[MarkBsnr]

***The only time the phrase “full of grace” is used in Scripture it is used to describe Jesus Christ. “And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) FULL OF GRACE and truth.” — John 1:14 You take the glory that is God’s alone and attribute it to a creature. Warmed-over paganism.

Amen.***

You guys really don’t know what’s in the Bible, do you?

Acts 6:
8
Now Stephen, filled with grace and power, was working great wonders and signs among the people.

How can you guys believe in sola scriptura when you all make statements like the above and then compound the error when you all agree with each other.

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

We have been having this discussion in our Sunday School. A point by the teacher was made that I would like to have a Calvinist explanation on.

In the garden, Adam and Eve sinned. According to what the bible tells us of the incident, we would assume that they were then spiritually dead, right? According to Calvinist beliefs then they would be unable to answer God’s call, yet, when God did call “Adam where art thou?” Adam answered....

If they were spiritually dead, and there is no indication they weren’t, how did they answer?

[Petronski]

KJV:

Act 6:8 And Stephen, full of grace and fortitude, did great wonders and signs among the people.

Yep, it’s even in “the original.”

[MarkBsnr]

Gnats and mosquitoes, sir. The annoyance of fleas and ticks. The irritation of scattered colonies of bedbugs.

The brightest angel has a multiplicity of human tools with which to attack the Church.

[Mad Dawg]

Only Catholics can understand

The above is excerpted from your post, using the technique often used by those who excerpt from the Catechism while arguing against the Church.

[Mad Dawg]

We are discussing Mary and her humanity, not systematic theology.

And then we'll move on to discussing the structure of the human arm, not anatomy, and then the dread aspects of an Obama presidency, not politics or government, and maybe after that sheep-raising not farming.

Was Mary born sinless and did she live sinless is the question that this thread is addressing,

This no doubt explains why the title of the thread is

The Worship of Mary? (An Observation)

and the question of her immaculate conception is not mentioned in the lead post. I guess we need commentators to tell us what the thread is really addressing, rather than going by the text. Protestants: The Magisterium for every day. Don't read the text, let THEM tell you what it's really about.

[Mad Dawg]

Yes, I figured you'd make some bizarre differentiation between the sacrament of penance and the penance given out during the sacrament of penance.

Yes. I like such bizarre distinctions:

• Finger and hand,
• sentence and paragraph,
• roof and house,
• part and whole.

  bi - I'm talkin' 'bout - ZARRE!