Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.
There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.
Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).
Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.
Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.
I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.
But do I WORSHIP them?
No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.
There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?
I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.
Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.
In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.
At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.
And by that she is "vindicated?"
This must be more of that vaunted protestant scholarship.
lol. No, by the grace of God, I prefer the KJV.
Certainly.
Then please explain your compliance with 1 Timothy 2:11-12.
No Calvinist believes that, but of course, that fact won't stop you from slinging the trash.
It's on par with Calvinism's decision last week to ordain PRACTICING homosexuals.
None at all?
Wow!
Do you have magical powers of perception or are there so few that you asked them all?
As if it's any of your business...
I am subservient to my husband whom God has given me to lead me and our family according to God's word and will.
When I was a doubting Presbyterian-in-name-only, my ex-Catholic, Jesuit-trained, Calvinist-by-the-grace-of-God husband led me back to Christ.
As God wills, for His glory and the welfare of His family.
Yup. Dirt-nap. At the sound of the trump the dead will rise first...
I know, 2 wrongs don’t make a right, I should have just ignored the curse and made nice.
You have been caught in so many errors and untruths it's amazing you show your face on these threads.
You've just added another lie to your tally.
How is that a lie? It made the news.
No, whatever is not of faith is worse than a mere work of men; it is a sin (Romans 14:23.)
You've just added another lie to your tally.
Unless you were completely unaware, the General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church (USA) voted last week to make it possible for practicing homosexuals to be ordained.
Whether you like it or not, members of the PCUSA consider themselves, and are generally considered to be, Calvinists.
YOU are bearing false witness by saying I lied.
lol. As God willeth the wafffer, so goeth the wafffer. 8~)
It can't be both. It's one of the other. If the RCC tells you Esau was blessed and rewarded and loved by God, then why are you so upset that I simply repeated what you said when you wrote..
The bible ignorance exhibited here is depressingly fascinating. I guess these fans of Esau's also admire the Herods, the Kings of Esau, the would be murderers of Christ, the murderers of John the Baptist..
You’re changing the subject. Prayer is not mere faith alone. It’s a work. You have said it sanctifies you.
Very odd for a Calvinist.
Do Catholics worship Mary?
And why, was that cartoon, the most fitting?
Not only is it not part of Catholic teaching, it is prohibited.
Of course every one of the billion Catholics in the world is a sinner. In any event, there’s too many to ask.
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