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Locked on 03/03/2008 9:42:54 AM PST by Religion Moderator, reason:
Childish behavior |
Posted on 02/22/2008 9:11:12 AM PST by Zakeet
They're called the "Lost Boys," the teenagers kicked out of their homes and communities by leaders of the polygamist Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints to ensure there's an ample supply of single, young women who will one day become plural wives. Representative Lorie Fowlke (R-Orem), is running a bill to make this abandonment a felony.
"Estimates are that we've had more than 1,000 children - primarily in southern Utah - thrown out of their homes," Fowlke says. "What we were trying to do with this bill is criminalize this behavior and send a message to this community that they can't just throw away their children."
H.B. 23 adds child abandonment to the definition of child abuse, and makes it a felony crime. It also adds an enhancement if a parent or organization benefits from the child's abandonment to further an illegal enterprise, such as polygamy. This is the case with the FLDS church, says Roger Hoole, a lawyer who represents some of the displaced young men and sits on the board for the Utah Association for Justice. He says the church benefits from kicking out young men who would compete for plural wives. This, he says, has devastating consequences.
"There's a huge impact that's coming, like a tsunami, that's going to hit the state of Utah, when these boys get a little older and realize what has happened to them and get angry," Hoole says. "There's a real problem here."
Fowlke's bill gained unanimous support in a Senate committee this morning, and now heads to the full Senate for consideration.
In your many posts accusing others of being "a natural man", are you then accusing them of being in a "fallen state"? And by comparison, are you saying YOU are saved? Hmmmmm!
Did you get narses in that ping?
ping-a-ling
Nope, but I have now ...
Now, now, resty hasn’t done all that she can do yet ...
Amen!
The Gospel is Good News
Dwight L. Moody
...God makes out pardons for men who have not got any character, who been very, very bad. He offers a pardon to ever sinner on earth if he will take it. I do not care who he is or what he is like. He may be the greatest libertine that ever walked the streets, or the greatest blackguard who ever lived, or the greatest drunkard, or thief, or vagabond; but I come tonight with glad tidings, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Elsie, he got your number! You’re slipping, fella.
Yeah.........what’s wrong with you, Elsie??? That should’ve been YOUR post number!!
Um, no!
A FEW SIMPLE QUESTIONS:
As man now is, God once was. As God now is, Man may become.
BTTT!
MHG,
Good post for several reasons:
1. Pointing out how those representing the cult of mormonism
favor the false prophet Joseph Smith over the Righteousness
of God Himself!
2. Pointing out the the founder of the cult of mormonism
was a serial adulterer.
3. To this I’d add that God reinforced this message in the
New Testament when it came to qualifications in Christ’s
Church. Only men who were the “husband of one wife” were
qualified. Joseph Smith and subsequent “prophets” were
unqualified to be Church leaders.
Best,
ampu
Zakeet,
Another excellent post! Bravo!
Don’t forget though, mormonism, like Jello,
will not allow itself to be nailed to a wall.
It is in constant motion and served as the
inspiration for “Jigglers”.
best,
ampu
REASON #1: It can result in false answers.
Muslims and Jehovah's Witnesses believe they receive confirmation their faith is true through prayer and revelation. Are they not just as convinced they are right as you are? And as a Mormon, don't you reject their faiths? And doesn't this prove praying for revelation can result in false answers?REASON #2: Mormon Church Leaders instructed me to examine the evidence, and to do this before I pray for revelation.
I say to the whole world, receive the truth, no matter who presents it to you. Take up the Bible, compare the religion of the Latter-day Saints with it, and see if it will stand the test … I am more afraid that this people have so much confidence in their leaders that they will not inquire for themselves of God whether they are led by Him … let every man and woman know themselves, whether their leaders are walking in the path the Lord dictates or not. This has been my exhortation continually. (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, 16:46, as cited by Harold B. Lee, Conference Report, October 1950, pp. 129-130).We are not so much concerned whether your thoughts are orthodox or heterodox as we are that you shall have thoughts … while all members should respect, support, and heed the teaching of the Authorities of the Church, no one should accept a statement and base his testimony upon it, no matter who makes it, until he has, under mature examination found it to be true and worthwhile; then his logical deductions may be confirmed by the spirit of revelation to his spirit because real conversion must come from within." (President Hugh B. Brown, a member of the LDS First Presidency, Dialog, Summer 1984, p. 15).
REASON #2: Praying for revelation is not valid is when we already have reliable information that answers a question.
For example, do you need to pray to find out how tall Mt. Everest is, or discover St. Louis is not the capital of the United States?In consideration of the above, I maintain Mormon leaders have indeed given wise advice. I therefore prefer to examine evidence in lieu of praying in the hope of receiving a warm fuzzy feeling.What can be accomplished in these cases through prayer? Is it possible for prayer to somehow invalidate the facts?
In defense of andysandmikesmom, What I saw in the referenced posts was not offensive, but defensive. She was obviously stricken with fear and rage at the plain meaning of God’s word. That can happen to anyone that is personally convicted by a particular passage of the word.
Since I was the messinger, I became the target.
Thank you for your comments...you and I will always disagree upon the subject of modern medicine and modern medical technology..I believe that the Bible does not forbid the use of modern medicine and modern medical technology, and you on the other hand, do believe that the Bible does forbid us from using modern medicines and modern medical technology, except for the instance I think you have mentioned, in instances of trauma, which seems to be the exception..I take that to mean, broken bones from accidents and such, gunshot wounds, knife wounds, and the like are allowed to have modern medical technolgy used to treat those things...but as far as the use of modern medicines to treat diseases, and the use of modern medical technology, to carry out operations, such as appendectomies, tonsil removal, heart surgery and such, I think you have stated in the past, that having these diseases treated, and these operations carried out, are going against the Bible...I am sure, if I am mischaracterizing your stand, you will correct me...
I know that in the past you have given me, Biblical verses to lend support to your belief, and yet, upon study of those verses, I just dont see it as you do...however, I was hardly stricken with fear or rage, because if that was actually true, that would have to be true of most Christians, who actually do use modern medicine and modern medical technology...There is really a very small percentage of people who refuse modern medicine and modern medical technolgy, based upon Biblical verses...most people within any given Christian denomination, always take advantage of modern medicine and modern medical technolgy, for themselves, and especially for their children...you happen to disagree with this, based on your reading of some Biblical verses....there is no fear or rage involved..otherwise, you would have to say that about most Christians, and that is just not true..
In any case, I believe in the use of modern medicine and modern medical technology, and do not believe the Bible forbids their use...you, believe differently...there is, of course, absolutely no rage, and no fear involved...just a difference of opinion, as to what your referenced Biblical verses are saying...
Which has actually been my whole point on this thread all along....people read Bible verses, and come away with completely different meanings....
Warrior cultures which have an obligation to care for the wives and children of dead relatives by marrying the widows are the only ones which seem to have “successful” polygamist societies. Most other examples of polygamy lead to something like the “lost boys.”
Yep, July 2006 would be about correct....I dont consider it a ‘long’ time from then till now, it is between a year and half, and two years, hardly what I would call a long time...it is just a difference of views I would guess...
No, Murray is not important to me, of no more importance than any other TV preacher...I watch them all, and have been watching a lot of them, for what I would call a ‘long’ time, 10/20 years....
Murray does have a unique and different viewpoint about Biblical Scriptures, and he obviously fills a void for many people who view ‘traditional’ Christian churches as lacking in answering some of their questions...his viewpoint is different and unique, viewpoints I have never heard before...after I started watching him, I noted that there were some posters here on FR, who seemed to embrace his teachings....especially the one about the Adam and the Eve being created on what Murray calls the 8th day of creation, and I have seen that view posted right here, on FR as well...I was struck that Murrays influence had shown itself right here on FR....
But as far as being important to me, perhaps important, only in that he shows, as a glaring example, how one can take Scriptures, and come out with an understanding that is completely outside of mainstream Christianity...I believe ‘important’ is the incorrect word to use here...’interesting’ would be the word I would use to describe how I feel about Murray....this is same as I feel about Benny Hinn, Jim Whitington, Jan and Paul Crouch, Oral and Richard Roberts, Rod Parsley, Ernest Angley, Billy Graham, Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, the Pope, and other religious preachers, leaders, and teachers, who use the TV airwaves...I watch them all, and find them all interesting, for many different reasons....
Arnold Murray is only the last and latest one that I have been viewing, so in all my years of watching these various religious teachers and leaders, my viewing time of Arnold Murray has been extremely short, and not ‘important’, merely interesting...
I have yet to meet two people that agree completely, 100 percent on everything, in every aspect...
You are absolutely correct...these disagreements do keep things interesting...
Yes, and I gave Bible references that prove it beyond a shadow of doubt.
"I am sure, if I am mischaracterizing your stand, you will correct me"
Yes, I must.
"Modern medicines" do not treat ilness, they modify symptoms, leaving the disease in place to continue ravaging the patient, and enrich the pharmaceutical, and medical technology industries.
Proven remedies that do not cause harm to the patient, and restore body function, which in turn cures disease exist, and they are actively attacked by the mega-med industry, much to our detriment.
Is that enough thread hijacking for you?
.
I always had a wonderful relationship with my dad, he was just the best dad to me and my brother, and an absolutely fabulous grandfather to my two boys...he died way too soon, I wish he was still here with us...he was so interested in everything in life, he would have delighted in the internet...unfortunately he died in 1989, so he never really had the chance to see what the internet had to offer...still, he had the fullest of lives, and relished every single moment, never wasting a minute of it...and he had a wonderful woman, my mom, by his side throughout most of his life, so tho he died way too soon, he died, loved by many, and missed by many...when he died, my mom received hundreds and hundreds of cards, and some very long letters from people who had been touched by my dad, at some point in their lives, and had wanted to let dads family know, how much he meant to them...when a person dies, it is of a great consolation to the family, to realize that not only do you miss that person, but so many other people do so as well...
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