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To: Forest Keeper; annalex; HarleyD; Kolokotronis; Quix; kawaii; Dr. Eckleburg
Paul is not urging the departed, he is urging live people, the audience for his letter. The assertion that this equally applies to the departed is completely fabricated by the Church

If the Saints are alive, as we believe they are, then they are praying for us, and this expectation is not outside of the confines of the Christian faith.

But I must agree with you, FK, that we have no biblical evidence whatsoever that saints intercede on our behalf, and specifically in resposne to our prayers.

I never pray to Theotokos or other Saints. I do thank them, whether they can hear me or not, for being the role models for us to follow and for their sacrifices.

12,324 posted on 04/09/2007 8:06:17 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; Forest Keeper; annalex; HarleyD; Kolokotronis; Quix; Dr. Eckleburg

John wrote Revelation not Paul, and John refers to the prayers of the Saints. Did John (or any other apostle) ever refer to the saints as living as St Paul does?


12,329 posted on 04/10/2007 7:01:26 AM PDT by kawaii (Orthodox Christianity -- Proclaiming the Truth Since 33 A.D.)
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To: kosta50
But I must agree with you, FK, that we have no biblical evidence whatsoever that saints intercede on our behalf, and specifically in resposne to our prayers.

Here is one strong example that the saints intercede,there are others

"When he took it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each of the elders held a harp and gold bowls filled with incense, which are the prayers of the holy ones". (Revelation 5:8)

I think that Revelation 5:8 gives a good indication that the prayers of the saints (on heaven and earth) are presented to God by the angels and saints in heaven. This shows that the saints intercede on our behalf before God, and it also demonstrates that our prayers on earth are united with their prayers in heaven

12,349 posted on 04/10/2007 4:35:38 PM PDT by stfassisi ("Above all gifts that Christ gives his beloved is that of overcoming self"St Francis Assisi)
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