Posted on 10/16/2006 8:27:21 AM PDT by NYer
Pope Benedict XVI celebrates the canonization ceremony of Italian nun Rosa Venerini, Mexican bishop Rafael Guizar, Italian priest Filippo Smaldone and Indiana nun Theodore Guerin in St. Peter's square at the Vatican, October 15, 2006. REUTERS/Giampiero Sposito
By Tom Heneghan, Religion Editor
PARIS (Reuters) - After almost two decades of schism, Catholic traditionalists hope the Vatican will soon take them back into the fold by granting two key concessions and leaving unresolved the main issue that drove them away.
Bishop Bernard Fellay, head of the Society of Saint Pius X (SSPX), says the expected revival of the old Latin mass that was replaced in the 1960s by modern liturgy in local languages would be a "grand gesture" meeting one of his demands.
The Swiss bishop, successor to the late SSPX founder French Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, also expects the Vatican to lift the 1988 excommunications of Lefebvre and four bishops -- including Fellay -- whom he consecrated without Rome's approval.
"Things are going in the right direction. I think we'll get an agreement," Fellay told journalists in Paris at the weekend. "Things could speed up and come faster than expected."
Getting an agreement now would mean the Swiss-based SSPX and its 470 priests could return to the Roman fold without resolving a dispute over its opposition to the modernising reforms of the Second Vatican Council (1962-1965).
Claiming a million followers, the SSPX is the vanguard of traditionalists among 1.1 billion Catholics worldwide. Its return would have no direct effect on most parishes but high symbolic value for arch-conservatives in the Church.
The excommunications by the late Pope John Paul created the first schism in the Church in modern times. Since his election last year, Pope Benedict has been trying to hold out an olive branch to the SSPX.
Fellay envisages the SSPX would be an independent group within the Church, free of control by local bishops, while it continued to advocate rolling back other Vatican II reforms.
"We would be a bit like the Chinese Patriotic Church, in the Church without really being there," he explained. "There could be a relationship between Rome and us, but it would not yet be a juridical relationship."
"INTERMEDIATE STATE"
Speculation about an SSPX return arose last week when Vatican sources said Pope Benedict would soon allow wider use of the old Tridentine Mass in Latin that went out of favour when the Church switched to praying in local languages in the 1960s.
Priests can say the old mass if they get permission but few bishops grant it and demand for Latin rites is minimal. Most Catholics under 50 years old have never heard Latin spoken.
The SSPX thinks the post-Council liturgy, which stresses participation by worshippers in open praying and singing, has lost the sacred character and beauty of the traditional mass.
The Tridentine rite it prefers is solemn, with the priest and altar boys quietly reciting the prayers in Latin with their backs to the silent congregation.
The traditionalists also reject the Council decision that the Church, which long saw itself as the only path to salvation, should respect and work together with other faiths.
Echoing this, a senior SSPX official sparked controversy last year by urging the Pope to tell Jews and followers of other religions to convert from their "false systems" to Catholicism.
Fellay said the SSPX sought an "intermediate state" in the Church so it could continue to oppose what Lefebvre called "neo-Modernist and neo-Protestant tendencies ... in the Second Vatican Council and in all the reforms which issued from it."
"We don't want a practical solution before these doctrinal questions are resolved," he said. "The focus should be on these discussions."
Benedict, who sparked protest across the Muslim world last month with a speech hinting that Islam had been spread by the sword, has frequently stressed his support for Vatican II reforms including cooperation with other faiths.
I think he's in for a very rude awakening.
Memo to Fellay Mignon:
Even though you're French, you're not an Emperor.
Hell, you're not even the Pope.
You're a bishop . . . and a bishop whose consecration was without Apostolic Mandate.
If you think that's no small matter to Pope Benedict XVI, think again.
Anyhow . . . dealing with the SSPX is a little like dealing with the Muslims: no self-criticism and no reciprocity.
I think the Pope has well and truly called their bluff: establish a Religious Institute for those who want to come back and issue a moto proprio regarding the Traditional Mass . . . and then, as a parent to tantrum-prone children, OK - NOW WHAT IS IT?
They may be treated like Opus Dei.
Its not unheard of.
And a world-wide indult to boot.
That would be amazing.
God surprizes us time and again.
Bishop Fellay is Swiss, not French.
I can just feel the Christian charity pouring out of you.
The traditionalists also reject the Council decision that the Church, which long saw itself as the only path to salvation, should respect and work together with other faiths.
The Church does say it is the only path to salvation, no? It is just a bit more tolerant now than it may have been...?
And the few theological ideas he does have - such as the mass is evil, the Jews are cursed, and Vatican Two is heretical - are due to insanity which schisms inevitably cause.
The insane rind around his entire faux idea of Tradition prevents the quickening grace of the Holy Spirit from restoring life to his soul and leading him to repentance and a return to the Rock.
He is clearly insane. Lefevbre was just as insane. Schism breeds insanity. It is ineluctable
Yawn.
I think it all agit/prop. Fellay KNOWS his schism is dead and so he needs to "keep hope alive" in the schism. He keeps floating this nonsense Rome is about to cave to keep the Hive happy and to keep those donations coming in.
If those who succor the schism ever figure out the schism leads only to Hell, Fellay is toast. Outside of the schism nobody knows or cares about him. He has to both keep Schism alive whle at the same time engaging in non-productive agit/prop about putative deals to keep his face in the news and to keep the Hive happily buzing about their impending Traditional Triumph.
When the schism ends, so does Fellay's celebrity. Don't neglect the role of Pride in Fellay's agit/prop.
Each failed deal is blamed on modernist Rome and each failed deal is cast as a triumph of Tradition and its supporters. It is all so predictable because it has been endlessly repeated the past 20 years.
That few in the schism can see this is yet another indication the schism breeds insanity.
It is said insanity is doing the same thing over and over yet expecting different results. If that doesn't describe the sspx schism's agit/prop, what does?
Hell is extremely boring
It is not Bishop Fellay floating the rumors, why are you so quick to believe the secular press about anything?
16-October-2006 -- Catholic World News Brief LEFEBVRISTS READY TO SEEK RECONCILIATION?
Oct. 16 (CWNews.com) - The head of the traditionalist Society of St. Pius X (SSPX) might write to the Pope, asking for a removal of the excommunications levied on Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre and the bishops he ordained in 1998, according to a French newspaper report.
The daily Le Figaro reports that Bishop Bernard Fellay is prepared to write to the Pontiff, seeking reconciliation of the traditionalist group, if Pope Benedict XVI goes through with plans to allow broader use of the Tridentine Mass.
The SSPX denied the accuracy of the Figaro report, saying that the newspaper's reporter had misunderstood the purpose of a letter from Bishop Fellay to the Holy Father. In fact, the SSPX news agency reported, the bishop has sent the Pope a spiritual bouquet, in which traditionalists have offered 1 million rosaries for the liberalization of the old Latin rite. No request for removal of the 1988 excommunications has been made, the group insists.
Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos, the prefect of the Congregation for Clergy, reportedly wrote to Bishop Fellay some months ago, assuring him that the Pope plans to allow free use of the pre-conciliar rite, and suggesting that the Lefebvrist group should make a request for the Pope to lift the excommunications.
SSPX leaders have consistently set conditions for their reconciliation with the Vatican, including the liberation of the old Latin Mass, the removal of the excommunications, and the freedom to question Vatican II teachings on issues such as religious freedom and ecumenism. By authorizing the universal use of the Tridentine liturgy-- as he is reporting planning to do in a forthcoming document-- the Pope would fulfill the first and most prominent of the traditionalists' demands.
Bishop Fellay avoided speculating on the reported papal initiative in discussions with reporters this weekend. But he did say that a document of the sort reportedly due to appear soon would be a "great gesture" and a major step toward reconciliation between the SSPX and the Vatican. He predicted, however, that the release of the papal document would precipitate fierce controversy within the Church.
"Bishop Fellay avoided speculating on the reported papal initiative in discussions with reporters this weekend. But he did say that a document of the sort reportedly due to appear soon would be a "great gesture" and a major step toward reconciliation between the SSPX and the Vatican. He predicted, however, that the release of the papal document would precipitate fierce controversy within the Church."
Fierce controversy indeed, some people are positively apoplectic.
*Not me. There is not a possibility the sspx wil be regularised absent a confession of wrong-doing and the sspx thinks it is the real church. I don't get nervous about impossibilities.
It is not Bishop Fellay floating the rumors, why are you so quick to believe the secular press about anything?
*The secular press is more reliable than Fellay.
BUMP!
Keep telling yourself that.
Your other posts make you sound a lot like these guys.
*LMAO Here you have a schismatic Bishop speaking openly about attacking an Ecumenical Council and treating it as though it was the personal project of Cardinals Medina dn Ratzinger and still we are supposed to think the Pope is gong surrender the Keys to these Protestants in Fiddlebacks.
Insanity insanity. all is insanity within the schism
Once again, let’s look at Campos and the regression of Bishop Rifan, its head. Months before he was consecrated a bishop, Fr. Rifan participated in the local diocesan Corpus Christi procession. To traditional Catholics who opposed his participation, he replied, "If I do not go, I will jeopardize any agreement with Rome." Also, a few months before his consecration, he said in Rome to the Vicar General —who repeated it to Fr. Schmidberger, so we have it from a direct source: "I have no problem with celebrating the New Mass, but I don’t do it because it would cause trouble to the faithful." So when Rome consecrated Fr. Rifan a bishop, they knew already that he had no objection to celebrating the New Mass. I think it is important to see that. These are the first steps. It shows you the direction..
*This crackpot teaches the Pauline Rite is evil. He refuses to say it and yet y'all think Rome is panting to absorb back into the Body of Christ such a malignant and deadly infection?
Truly, schism breeds insanity
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