California bishop responds to lay group (re Tridentine Mass)

Renew America ^ | September 14, 2006 | Matt C. Abbott

[NYer]

In the ongoing saga in the Diocese of Orange, Calif., Bishop Tod Brown has formally responded to the Catholic lay group Restore the Sacred. The text of the bishop's letter (dated September 6, 2006), which was sent to a member of Restore the Sacred, is as follows:

Dear [Name Withheld],



I have been reflecting on the meeting I had with you and others from St. Mary's by the Sea Parish on the 10th of July. I was impressed by the love for our Catholic faith and the dedication to St. Mary's by the Sea parish that all of you manifested. You helped me to understand your concerns more fully and I appreciated the clear and respectful way that you answered my questions.



As I told you I would, I directed Father Martin Tran to present in your parish bulletin a fuller, and I trust, acceptable apology and clarification of his views on obedience, mortal sin, and kneeling. He has done this and has assured me that he is hoping to be able to work with you and all those who attend the parish in a respectful and productive manner.



One of the things that came out clearly in your description of the "traditions of St. Mary's" was that I and my predecessors did you no service when we allowed Fr. Johnson to deviate from the liturgical norms set out by church authority. You feel now a sense of betrayal and your request for a restoration of what you consider nine fundamental past traditions reflects your desire to hold on to an experience that has, in some important ways, nourished your faith over a long period of time. I apologize for the hurt and misunderstanding this has caused.



That having been said, let me address the particular requests you made in your document and in your presentation:



• The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops has determined that in the United States, Holy Communion is received standing and that the appropriate sign of respect is a bow of the head before the Sacrament. The Diocese of Orange is obliged to observe this norm. It is helpful to reflect on why the Church in the United States has mandated this posture: standing is appropriate for those who are risen with Christ and who seek the things that are above. As people united in faith, we are also united in our common posture which serves to foster the intention and spiritual attitude of being one in Christ.
  
  

• In this diocese I have determined that the faithful will stand from the Great Amen until after receiving Holy Communion. This posture reflects our humble gratitude for the great things God has done in creating and redeeming us. We also recognize the eschatological significance of standing as we look forward to the day when Christ will come again and pray that Christ may find us worthy to stand before Him. After the reception of communion, each participant is free to kneel or sit, however they choose.
  
  

• The Sign of Peace is exchanged as a token of Christian communion, as a sign of our fellowship and unity before we partake in the ultimate sign of our unity, the Body and Blood of Christ. The custom of our culture would commonly be shaking hands, though the manner of the exchange is left up to the individual. It is important, however, that the priest celebrant express with the faithful gathered their ecclesial communion and mutual charity before partaking in Holy Communion.
  
  

• The participation of women as altar servers, cantors, and lectors, is a sign of the basic equality of every baptized member of Christ: we are all called to service in light of our God given gifts. It has also been determined in 1971 by the Bishop's Committee on the Liturgy in consultation with the Vatican, that this is a legitimate liturgical practice. To remove women from the sanctuary would denigrate the fundamental dignity of women ad their complementary role in God's created world.
  
  

• It is the purview of the local administrator whether or not the celebrants at Masses should have the assistance of extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist and the placement and furnishings of the sanctuary. He is also responsible for overseeing the selection of all music to be used at parish liturgies; I refer you to him about these matters.
  
  

• In view of the context of so much negative publicity, public protests and controversy associated with the liturgy at St. Mary's by the Sea, I judge that the restoration of the Tridentine Mass at your parish at this time would only cause greater disunity and confusion. Although you may not be aware of it, there are a considerable number of parishioners who are grateful for the changes that brought their parish in conformity with other parishes in our Diocese. They and the people of the Diocese generally would likely view permission for the Tridentine Mass so close upon the protests as nothing less than a capitulation to a special interest group. This is not to say that, sometime in the future, there may be an appropriate time when the question can be raised again.
  
  

My decision on these requests is based upon my ecclesiology. What unifies us most is the Blessed Sacrament that we share at Mass and, most significantly, in the reception of communion. This is where there should be some uniformity in our life as Catholics. Although there is room for variety in music, preaching and the way these rights are celebrated, these all must adhere to the backbone of liturgical legislation set down by the church. Outside the Mass, there is great room for other rites and prayer forms (Benediction of the Blessed Sacrament, 40 Hours devotions, the Liturgy of the Hours, novenas, etc.) which can be done in the "traditional" manner and with the sacred music that is so dear to you. There are even adaptations approved for the Liturgy of the Eucharist (Eucharistic processions, which I think you have had in the past, is one example) which you may wish to consider with Fr. Martin.



I recognize that this letter is likely a disappointment to you. You were hoping for so much more. Be assured that my decisions mean you no disrespect. On the contrary, I hope my clarity makes it possible for us, should you choose, to work together to preserve what you love about the Catholic Church in ways that match our liturgical norms.



In Christ Our Savior,



Most Reverend Tod D. Brown
Bishop of the Diocese of Orange

[technochick99]

Abp.Fulton J.Sheen before the KoC Jun/1972. “Who is going to save our Church ? Not our bishops, not our priests and religious. It is up to you, the people. You have the minds, the eyes, the ears to save the Church. Your mission is to see that your priests act like priests, your bishops like bishops and your religious act like religious.”

[Dominick]

Like I said the protest was pretty much a failure, doomed to fail. If it were in Gods will for the group to succeed no protest would be required.

[Convert from ECUSA]

Nailed it!

[ninenot]

While I question your underlying rationale in the statement "And finally, we must reflect that, were it not for SSPX, the Tridentine Mass would not today be available anywhere on the surface of the planet, to anyone. The modernists came that close to final victory", I cannot deny the fact that the SSPX was responsible for its continuation.

OTOH, I think that all rational Conservatives will be pleased with what B-16 will do in the future.

[ninenot]

St Catherine of Siena, Athanasius...Paul to Peter's face...

There are plenty of examples of 'protesters' in the Church's history.

[ninenot]

...joining Rembert Weakland, OSB in that anti-nomianism.

[ninenot]

Oh, I don't know.

The Old Rite was available here in Milwaukee before SSPX, too--but only because there was a "wink-wink" arrangement with R Weakland (of ALL people!!!)

But I think the case could be made that JPII wrote the Indult because he was concerned that SSPX & Co. were becoming "an alternative" for a number of otherwise-faithful RC's who were NOT questioning other provisions of VatII, nor were collecting memorabilia from a certain German regime from c. 1932-1945.

No, SSPX was not the Single Influence. But it had critical mass--moreso than the here-and-there onesy-twoseys around the US and Europe.

[BlackElk]

dsc:

1. The correct name of Henry VIII's martyred Chancellor is St. Thomas MORE not Moore. The correct name of the dishonest and malignant founder of SSPX is LEFEVBRE and not Lefebre. I only mention these because you have made the same mistakes several times (to coin a phrase).

2. If the truth as to the excommunicated schismatics of SSPX does not satisfy you, that is your problem not mine or that of Holy Mother the Church.

3. I hate SSPX's sins. We are of course admonished to love the sinners themselves which is why it makes sense to remind them of their sins so they may repent and do penance in a timely manner before it is too late. Love is not telling the miscreants what they want to hear but what they have to hear.

4. Bishop Doran is as favorable to the Tridentine Mass as any bishop and allows all of his priests to say it without further permission. Let SSPX set its cloven hooves into this diocese and start bossing Doran around and he will get his Irish up and probably retaliate against the SSPX and its stated delusions. That might not spare the already generally allowed Tridentine Mass (and sacraments such as Baptism and Confirmation and Matrimony for that matter). SSPX's schismatic impudence and attitude is the single biggest stumbling block to the restoration of the Tridentine Mass as the normative Mass of the Latin Rite.

5. Since my wedding was the first in the Tridentine Rite in the United States (to the best of the Wanderer's ability to determine) since the liturgical changes of the 1960s, ummmmmm, yes, it required Archbishop Whealon's permission and he gave it promptly upon popular request and he also granted other requests for conventional Tridentine Masses of obligation as early as 1970 or so upon my request and gave us use of the then thoroughly traditional chapel at the seminary in Bloomfield for a Tridentine Mass in relation to the tenth anniversary conference of Young Americans for Freedom. When, at 4:55 PM on the Friday before my Saturday wedding, chancery liberal termites told my pastor that a terrible mistake had been made and that the wedding Mass was to be a Latin Novus Ordo, I communicated this scenario to the archbishop through an unknown priest answering telephones after hours at the chancery on his way to an Army Reserve meeting and by the time I walked three blocks to the rectory, Archbishop Whealon had called the pastor. The pastor greeted me with joy (although he was personally not a Tridentine enthusiast) and said: Good News! The archbishop called and said that your wedding Mass will be Tridentine and if anyone says otherwise they had better outrank him in the archdiocese or they will face the consequences of violating his orders. Thus, Archbishop Whealon did more than grant special permission, he came down in favor of our Tridentine Mass with his full authority against his own chancery officials. Of course, those officials tried to thwart his will behind his back and without his knowledge. In our letter requesting permission, my wife and I expressed our desire for a Tridentine Mass, our understanding that the request might have to be denied consistent with Archbishop Whealon's understanding of his own obligations as ordinary and that we would accept his decision either way. We did not play bull in a china shop, huffing and puffing, and bossing the archbishop around. We leave that behavior to the SSPX and their excommunicated ilk.

6. Every Tridentine Mass (Hartford's Our Lady of Sorrows monthly and New Haven's Sacred Heart weekly and holydays) granted by Archbishop Whealon on a regular basis have been continued by his distinctly inferior successors, Daniel Cronin and Henry Mansell. To the best of my knowledge the SSPX schismatic excommunicates have never trespassed on the entire territory of the Archdiocese of Hartford and have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with its Tridentine Masses being allowed.

7. Malignant and dishonest behavior of Lefebvre includes among many other things:

a. Marcel's agreement to JP II's terms and to cancel the illicit consecrations as illicit bishops of the Econe Four and his mealy-mouthed cancellation of his agreement, coupled with attacks on papal authority, all in service to his idjit delusion that direct disobedience to the pope and consecration of four illicit bishops was necessary in what passed for Marcel's mind to continue the Church (a direct Marcellian rejection of Jesus Christ's promises to the contrary as well).

b. The oft-repeated fantasy that the Hawaii 7 (or whatever number) were excommunicated for attending SSPX Masses (that is the lie of disgraced Archbishop Ferrario and the SSPX and the Vatican saw right through it and acted accordingly) rather than for outing Ferrario for his hobby of homosexuality and his subsidy of his ex-altar boy and San Francisco "treat."

8. White-hot opprobrium???? Yeah, that will do as a description for now. SSPX needs desperately to have its infernal pride smashed to smithereens. Humiliation should be the merest beginning of their temporal punishment. Dunk them in Holy Water and hear them scream like banshees confronted with a crucifix. Banishment and cloister and complete public recantation of their sins and posturing against the papacy and the Church should also be included. Public profound physical penance just short of death would be nice. I feel the same way about Luther, Calvin and Zwingli, though, and for the same reasons. For those three, penance is too late but a lot of SSPXers are still holding onto life.

9. Doesn't every Catholic hope that such miscreants be brought to justice and punishment in life before it is too late???? While we failed with Luther, Calvin and Zwingli, we must redouble our efforts not to fail again with Fellay, Williamson, that other French twit (de Mallerais????) who presumes to instruct B-XVI, and whoever the fourth living miscreant "bishop" may be. Likewise, their adherents excommunicated by Ecclesia Dei at its time and in advance.

10. I will certainly agree that, having drunk the SSPX Kool Aid, you are no authority on SSPX. John Paul the Great was and he acted accordingly.

11. You may well think that the moon is made of green cheese but that will not make it so.

[Tax-chick]

Xowie, you have a lot of words today! Did you know that tomorrow is National Talk Like a Pirate Day?

[BlackElk]

In the Hartford Archdiocese, we had a weekly and holy day Tridentine Mass at New Haven and a monthly one at Hartford for years before Marcel's dishonest temper tantrums and consecration of bishops against JP II's direct orders. There was no SSPX in the Hartford Archdiocese then through now (to the best of my knowledge) or anywhere else in Connecticut (TTBOMK).

The Milwaukee Archdiocese in the days of Weakland and of Cousins always had great Catholics like ninenot and may have had Tridentine Masses but I don't think that you would argue that, whatever the sins of the AmChurch, Milwaukee under Weakland was not in particularly scandalous shape.

Did Weakland actually give permission or did he ignore the Tridentine Masses?

As to SSPX reaching critical mass (they were certainly critical in the whiny sense and they certainly said Masses but the combination does not mean that they reached critical mass)

You are also forgetting the SSPXers who probably think that 9/11 was an "inside" job or that Williamson is a collector of such memorabilia or at least a denier of historical truth as to the misbehavior of same.

God bless you and yours!

[BlackElk]

dsc: Whatever Jesus Christ did was, by definition, the right thing..... for Jesus Christ to do. I am not Jesus Christ. Dominick is not Jesus Christ. And, ummmmmmm, YOU are not Jesus Christ. Our best bet is to do as He said and honor that Scriptural passage in Matthew known as the Peter passage, recognize that He is with His Church to the end of time and that the gates of hell will not prevail against it. Neither will the gates of Marcel prevail against it.

Rule #1: The pope is Jesus Christ's Vicar on Earth. What he binds on earth shall be bound in heaven. What he looses on earth shall be loosed in heaven. The pope wields the Keys of the Kingdom. (Or did you miss that part of your Bible???? as SSPX clearly has)

Rule #2: If you disagree with Rule #1, re-read it continuously until you DO believe it. Jesus Christ told no lies.

[BlackElk]

At last!!!!!

[Tax-chick]

I'll expect to see at least one of your cheery posts in Pirate-ese. Avast!

[dsc]

"I only mention these because you have made the same mistakes several times (to coin a phrase)."

That would be a lot more effective if I actually had made those errors several times. However, I only made those typos once.

Sometimes white-hot opporobrium makes us so eager to strike a blow that we tromp on our own hooters.

"Bishop Doran is as favorable to the Tridentine Mass as any bishop and allows all of his priests to say it without further permission."

That's very good. If the SSPX hadn't done what they did, Doran would not have permission from the Vatican to allow his priests to say the Tridentine. The indult was only handed down in an attempt to derail the SSPX.

"We did not play bull in a china shop, huffing and puffing, and bossing the archbishop around."

I think that's a mischaracterization. Their disobedience to wrongful orders has been reluctant and reserved.

"Thus, Archbishop Whealon did more than grant special permission, he came down in favor of our Tridentine Mass with his full authority against his own chancery officials."

He's no longer with us, though. Who is there to do that today?

"Marcel's agreement to JP II's terms and to cancel the illicit consecrations as illicit bishops of the Econe Four and his mealy-mouthed cancellation of his agreement"

I don't understand why you keep saying that. Lefevbre agreed to one set of conditions. Having gained his agreement, the Vatican promptly changed the conditions: there would be only one bishop, and Vatican bureaucrats would choose him with no input from SSPX. In other words, it was a dirty little trick aimed at killing SSPX and the Tridentine. By any standards of law and morality, a party can declare a contract null if the other party unilaterally changes or imposes conditions.

"The oft-repeated fantasy that the Hawaii 7 (or whatever number) were excommunicated for attending SSPX Masses "

Well, that's the history I have. If you have evidence to the contrary, please produce it.

"To the best of my knowledge the SSPX schismatic excommunicates have never trespassed on the entire territory of the Archdiocese of Hartford and have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with its Tridentine Masses being allowed."

Without them, the Tridentine would today be completely suppressed.

"in service to his idjit delusion that direct disobedience to the pope and consecration of four illicit bishops was necessary in what passed for Marcel's mind to continue the Church (a direct Marcellian rejection of Jesus Christ's promises to the contrary as well)."

Our Lord promised that the Church would triumph in the end; He never said their wouldn't be battles, and even battles lost. He didn't say, "Okay, you can just kick back, stop fighting the evil one, and wait for the Second Coming."

Frankly, I wonder what the Church would look like today, what road it would be on, if the enemies of the Church had succeeded in suppressing the Tridentine back in the 60s.

"having drunk the SSPX Kool Aid, you"

There's no need to be insulting. I haven't drunk anyone's Kool Aid. I merely seek the truth of these issues, and I think your version of events is unduly biased.

"You may well think that the moon is made of green cheese but that will not make it so."

And back atcha.

[Religion Moderator]

Discuss the issues all you want, but do NOT make it personal.

[ichabod1]

Yes, and wasn't Beckett's protest against the King and not against the Pope?

[Dominick]

In Becketts case, and every other saint, not against a Bishop.

[ichabod1]

I don't think the TLM indult is as uncommon as you suppose. I don't think anybody is going to be getting in trouble for doing it in most dioceses. I don't know what to say about California, except that it would be a better and better thing by the day, if the whole state were to fall off into the Pacific Ocean.

[dsc]

"I don't think the TLM indult is as uncommon as you suppose."

My point is that it came into being in reaction to SSPX in the first place.

[ichabod1]

Wow, Talk Like A Pirate day is really catching on. I heard about it at lunch today as well. I only wish Systems Administrators Day would get the same growth.