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To: Campion
It is true that the Church catholic recognized through the power of the Holy Spirit, the inspired canon of the New Testament.

There are art experts in the Smithsonian who can recognize a true Rembrandt from a fake. This doesn't make the expert a master painter, either equal to or the sole interpreter of Rembrandt. Recognition is not the same as creating or providing.

It's the same with the organizaton of the Roman church...just because it has recognized God's Word--and posesses it, scripture is still God's Word, not the Church's word....which it can control, interpret (and misinterpret...see the Copernicus affair among many others) and enforce at will--according to the needs of the day.

Scripture was written (primarily) by the first Apostles through the authority and inspiration of the Holy Spirit. It was a gift TO the Church, not a gift FROM the Church.

When the corruption of the Roman church became so bad in the late medieval period, certain men stood up for the authority of God...through His revealed Word, the scripture, over and above the organization of Rome. They weren't trying to split up the RC church, nor were they arrogantly calling for every man to interpret the bible independently... they were hoping to help the Roman Church to become obedient to the Bible.(if you read, for example, Luther's 95 Theses, it is remarkably respectful and conciliatory...clearly he wasn't picking a fight--but as a respected Roman Catholic university professor/bible scholar, wanted to help reform the RC church) Since they dared rattle the money tree of indulgences...they were subsequently excommunicated, burned at the stake or both...and when the survivors protestested the abuses of power in the name of Catholicism by the Holy Roman Emporer Charles V, they were named (pejoratively) Protestants.

The more I know of Church history, the less attractive the body under the Bishop of Rome appears.

125 posted on 02/06/2006 9:20:07 AM PST by AnalogReigns ("by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God.")
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To: AnalogReigns
It's the same with the organizaton of the Roman church...just because it has recognized God's Word--and posesses it, scripture is still God's Word, not the Church's word....which it can control, interpret (and misinterpret...see the Copernicus affair among many others)

The Copernicus affair? What was that?

Protestants set themselves up as authoritative interpreters of Scripture, all the time. I don't recognize their authority any more than you recognize the authority of the Pope.

132 posted on 02/06/2006 9:46:31 AM PST by Campion ("I am so tired of you, liberal church in America" -- Mother Angelica, 1993)
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To: AnalogReigns; Campion
There are art experts in the Smithsonian who can recognize a true Rembrandt from a fake. This doesn't make the expert a master painter, either equal to or the sole interpreter of Rembrandt. Recognition is not the same as creating or providing.

Not a good analogy...The "art experts" HAVE seen a true Rembrandt. You take the Catholic Church's WORD that the Scripture is God's Word written down. You are using a circular argument to "recognize" true Scripture by opening up the bible. You know that the Gospel of Thomas is a fraud ONLY because there is someone who has actually seen and heard God's Word AND said "the Gospel of Thomas is not it". Regards

137 posted on 02/06/2006 10:52:15 AM PST by jo kus
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