Scriptures mention "being saved" as a past, a present, or a future act. Thus, in one sense, we are "saved" when we are baptised, being saved during sanctification, and will be saved when we enter heaven. Here is where sometimes we talk past each other. Often times, Protestants refer to the one past event, while Catholics are refering to the future event. Thus, the misunderstandings.
Anyway, as to whether we can be sure, I would just look to God's promises to us for certainty.
The promises that you mention are rules of thumb for the general person. Since I am human, with a warped sense of self, I would be deluding myself to think that I can fully know where I stand with God. We have a tendency to overlook our faults and exaggerate ourselves in God's (and others) eyes.
For example, John 10 - how do I, ME, Joe, know that I am one of the sheep who will hear Jesus' voice five years from now? I know people who seemed to be pretty good Christians - but later - fell away. Thus, we must persevere in Christ. I don't know what will happen in the future. NOW, I can have a pretty good idea (but not certain). But the future? No one can snatch me out of Christ's hand, but I can willingly leave the flock.
On Phillipians, we can be sure God will not abandon us. But will we abandon Him? I don't know for sure. I work out my salvation in fear and trembling, running the race to the end for fear of being disqualified from the prize. To say otherwise is called presumption - which Paul says "those who think they stand securely, beware lest you fall". As long as we abide in Christ, we will be saved. Bottom line.
We are told that no power, not even our own will, can snatch us from His hand.
I don't see that. Christ (and Paul in Romans 8) is refering to an external force that pries us out of God's grasp. If God respects the freedom of man - if God awaits our response to the choice He lays before us, then there must be a possibility that we will fall. Clearly, this means that God knew we would turn away. Does God force us to do good or evil?
regards
I appreciate your point, but I would hasten to add that there remain strong differences as to the method of salvation.
The promises that you mention are rules of thumb for the general person.
God's promises are rules of thumb to you? Rules of thumb can be bent or broken depending on the circumstances. Do you really see a promise from God as less than a sure thing?
No one can snatch me out of Christ's hand, but I can willingly leave the flock.
Presumably, you mean "and lose your salvation". You just said that you have the power to snatch yourself out of God's hand. I would say that if your salvation was true, God would not let you do that.
Christ (and Paul in Romans 8) is referring to an external force that pries us out of God's grasp. If God respects the freedom of man - if God awaits our response to the choice He lays before us, then there must be a possibility that we will fall. Clearly, this means that God knew we would turn away. Does God force us to do good or evil?
First, by external force, do you mean "yourself", as in above?
I say that God knows the freedom of man, and it is to choose evil. It is our born nature. Therefore, out of His love for us He does not defer to it, but rather saves the elect in spite of it.
If God awaits a response from us, when He already knows the (sometimes, bad) answer, how is this any less horrible than the God I have been describing throughout this whole thread? You seem to (correctly) admit that no chance is involved. Why does God "await"?
As to whether God "forces" us to do good, it depends on what you mean by force. (God never forces us to do evil. That's not His nature.) As for good, imagine you have just returned to your car from a long walk in the grocery store parking lot. You then discover the cashier mistakenly gave you $5 change you were not owed. The Spirit moves your conscience to compel you to walk all the way back to return the money. Assume you never would have done this before your faith. Were you "forced"? I would say that if you did it, then yes.