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To: HarleyD; kosta50
Sure. Augustine speaks of man's neutrality. No doubt about it. I just happen to think that Augustine didn't take his predestination premise far enough. He was on the correct track but didn't further the logical conclusion and implication that man's steps are ordained by the Lord.

Ok, first you quote Augustine completely and say he's completely correct and you follow everything this man said. Then, when told that Augustine actually didn't agree with the robot-maker idea, you state that Augustine didn't go far enough.

WHO went far enough, in your opinion? Rasputin? Anton Szandor LaVey?
1,934 posted on 01/24/2006 6:00:29 AM PST by Cronos (Never forget 9/11. Restore Hagia Sophia!)
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To: HarleyD; Cronos
Augustine speaks of man's neutrality. No doubt about it. I just happen to think that Augustine didn't take his predestination premise far enough (Harley D)

Ok, first you quote Augustine completely and say he's completely correct and you follow everything this man said. Then, when told that Augustine actually didn't agree with the robot-maker idea, you state that Augustine didn't go far enough (Cronos)

Blessed Augustine knew better than to put the blame of original sin on God. Whether you understand that this is what Proetstant theology teaches or not is immaterial. You are obviously pre-destined not to see somehting that is obvious to everyone else.

All the biblical verses and interpretations are meaningless unless we clear up the very source of your error -- namely the original sin. Did God will Adam to sin? Or did Adam opt to sin?

St. Augustine stopped short of accusing God. Adam did that already. We know that man is not completely dead because, unlike the fallen angels, God opts to offer man salvation; angels are condemned forever. Nothing can save them.

It is up to God to offer us to come back to Him in the likeness of Christ, and it is up to us to accept His offer, or perish. God is under no obligation, but He does offer His salvation to all, He shines His light on the rigtheous and the unrighteous.

We do not save ourselves. We can be saved only if we, accepting God's offer, in faith and obedience out of love imitate Christ so that we can regain the likeness of God we once had.

1,956 posted on 01/24/2006 3:18:07 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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