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To: x5452

The point I was driving at was that I would actually be interested in learning about Orthodox spirituality and what separates that spirituality from Eastern Catholic spirituality. (Thus the comparison)

However this author was more intent on making the point that, in his opinion, the Catholic Church was hardly better than the Protestants and that the Orthodox are the only refuge for truly authentic Christianity. No postive message on what characterizes this, no substantiation on what makes them authentic, only an unsupported assertion.

Such the pity, too, as all too often that is the tripe I see coming out of Orthodox writers. Let's hear some positive statements out of an attitude of catechesis, rather than constant defensiveness (e.g., we aren't Catholics, we're the real Church, and don't you forget it).


47 posted on 12/12/2005 8:54:25 AM PST by markomalley (Vivat Iesus!)
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To: markomalley

I think the person in the article's big mistake is to reduce it to a political debate, it isn't a political debate, it is a problem with 2 specific issues of doctrine. It is also not a question with a clear cut black and white historically verifibale right or wrong answer.

It is folly to assume it is simply a political issue.

That said an advantage I find of the Orthodox churches in America is that because they are smaller and closer knit, and even tied to the church as deeply as their national origins (note I've never met anyone who took offense at someone else's national origins in the Orthodox church but have found most to be proud of their heritage and dedicated to preserving it in their families) they live up to doctrine a lot better.

On paper the Catholic and Orthodox doctrine differ only very slightly. I do no expect anyone will be denied heaven for not acknowledging a primacy of jurisdiction of the pope nor for omiting the filoque. Nor do I suspect the inverse will deny one from heaven.

However there are big troubles in the PRACTICE of Catholic doctrine in America. Few go to confession before every communion (a problem liberal Orthodox churches have as well). Few follow the fasts (I would say I think more Orthodox obey the fasts on average, though it isn't universally practiced). Christmas on the 25th is highly commercialized, celebrating on the 7th of January one can feel less distracted by material concerns. The clergy sex abuse scandal and numbers of homosexual clergy in the Catholic church, especially not at all far from where I live is quite alarming. There are practical issues that are not ones of simple "doctrine of salvation" which make the Orthodox church attractive.

A big part of going to church is the faithful keeping eachother in line, almost as a support group would for an alcoholic. I don't deny there are deeply Orthodox pockets of Catholics but they are harder to find. That's a big reason I went with the Orthodox church even after attending Catholic school. I see a lot more Orthodox practicing the doctrine.


51 posted on 12/12/2005 9:11:20 AM PST by x5452
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To: markomalley
Ahem, this author is not exactly hailed among the Orthodox... just FYI. I have one of his books and am not fond of it at all.

He's not a great choice overall to represent us, imo.

73 posted on 12/12/2005 2:28:32 PM PST by MarMema (http://www.curenikolette.org/)
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