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Bishop Rifan of Campos concelebrates the Novus Ordo
DICI ^ | November 6, 2004 | Fr. Joel Danjou

Posted on 11/10/2004 12:59:06 PM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah

It is beyond doubt, Bishop Rifan did take active part in the New Mass. I watched the 3-hour video tape. This Mass was of the most modern and of an extreme liturgical poverty in spite of the presence of the cardinal representing the Pope. This cardinal was beside often hesitating, not guessing what one or the other of the assistant priests or bishops or the acolytes would be doing next. The miraculous statue was brought at the beginning of the ceremony in a spectacular procession recalling how 3 fishermen miraculously drew in this little 36 cm-high statue in 1717. A beautiful procession indeed, but not suited to a church. Imagine a boat with three fishermen coming up the aisle all the way to the sanctuary… One of the fishermen then placed the statue on its pedestal after having shown it to the different rows of the faithful… each time to the general clapping of hands.

When it was time for the epistle, the governor of Sao Paulo, (center-right politically), came forward to read it.

For the crowning of the statue, a woman – seated next to the bishops in the sanctuary during the ceremony – fetched the statue and presented it to the cardinal to be crowned. Once the statue was crowned, she presented it several times to the clergy and the faithful who were warmly applauding, while confetti were raining down on the heads of the cardinal and the bishops in the sanctuary.

At the offertory, two young acolytes came to pour the wine to be consecrated into the chalices as casually as if they were pouring themselves a glass of water.

The words of consecration pronounced aloud by cardinal de Araújo Sales were, of course, those saying : "…shed for you and for all." The eucharistic prayer n° 2 had been chosen by the bishop.

Then one could see Bishop Rifan joining the bishops’ procession to communicate at the altar. As for the communion of the faithful, no priest or bishop were seen distributing it.

However, at least three women were giving communion… and we saw priests (maybe even bishops) receiving communion from one of them!

Immediately after the Postcommunion, Petrus Ananias, minister for social development (Marxist Workers’ Party), representing Mr. Lula, president of the Republic, began some kind of sermon-discourse from the very sanctuary. All the bishops sat there without flinching! He praised the ecumenical trend of his party, made reference to Jacques Maritain and stated that democracy had evangelical roots, that Our Lady of Aparecida was in solidarity with the movement of liberation and emancipation, and that she was a figure even more human than the Virgin of the Gospels because she was black… and so on, and so forth!

There seems to be marked uneasiness in Campos on this subject because today a priest from Rio who asked about this concelebration to a priest from Campos received as answer that it was not a concelebration but a bishops’ meeting at the shrine of Our Lady of Aparecida.

It is difficult not to speak of lie!

Indeed, CNBB, the Brazilian National Conference of Bishops, announced the following on its website on September, 8: "Hoje, dia 8 de setembro, às 9h, no Santuàrio Nacional, solene concelebração eucarística presidida pelo enviado especial do Papa. Dom Eugênio de Araújo Sales, e concelebrad pelo Núncio Apostólico, Dom Lorenzo Baldisseri, pelo arcebispo de Aparecida, cardeais, arcebispos, bispos e presbíteros – Today, 9/8/04, at 9:00 am, at the national shrine, solemn eucharistic concelebration presided by the special envoy of the Pope, Dom E…, and concelebrated by the Apostolic Nuncio, Dom L. B…, by the Archbishop of Aparecida, the cardinals, archbishops, bishops and priests."

What remains of the booklet published by the priests of Campos : "62 Reasons Why In Conscience, We Cannot Attend the New Mass."?

Fr Joël Danjou, Prior in Santa Maria, Brazil

date : 6/11/2004


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Current Events; Ecumenism; Ministry/Outreach; Religion & Culture; Theology; Worship
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To: bornacatholic

"Post a link to the Magisterial Teaching the Old Covenant is revoked."

St. Justin Martyr, Dialogue with Trypho the Jew:

"I have read, Trypho, that there will be a final law, and a covenant the most authoritative of all, which must be observed by all men who seek after the inheritance of God. That law on Horeb is old, and was only for you; but this is for all in general.

A law set down after another law abrogates that which was before it, and a covenant made later likewise VOIDS that which was earlier. An eternal and final law, the Christ, is given to us, a faithful covenant after which there shall be no law, no precept, no commandment."

St. Augustine, Contra adversarium legis et prophetarum libri duo:

"Just as the knowledge that we now have will be "put away" as the Apostle says, when we have that knowledge which he calls "face to face", so too it is necessary that the things given in shadows to the Jews in the Old Testament be put away by the revelation of the New Testament."

Pope St. Leo I (The Great), Sermons 63,5:

"For although He is the Author both of the old ways and of the new, still, He changed the sacraments of the prefigured promises, because He fulfilled the promises and put an end to announcements by His coming as the Announced."


301 posted on 11/15/2004 3:28:42 PM PST by Tantumergo
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To: Tantumergo
Ezekiel 37

21 And thou shalt say to them: Thus saith the Lord God: Behold, I will take of the children of Israel from the midst of the nations whither they are gone: and I will gather them on every side, and will bring them to their own land.

22 And I will make them one nation in the land on the mountains of Israel, and one king shall be king over them all: and they shall no more be two nations, neither shall they be divided any more into two kingdoms.

23 Nor shall they be defiled any more with their idols, nor with their abominations, nor with all their iniquities: and I will save them out of all the places in which they have sinned, and I will cleanse them: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.

24 And my servant David shall be king over them, and they shall have one shepherd: they shall walk in my judgments, and shall keep my commandments, and shall do them.

25 And they shall dwell in the land which I gave to my servant Jacob, wherein your fathers dwelt, and they shall dwell in it, they and their children, and their children's children, for ever: and David my servant shall be their prince for ever.

26 And I will make a covenant of peace with them,it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will establish them, and will multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for ever.

* The reason I posted the dialogue from the Catholic Legate was for your benefit. Sungenis is wrong - probably due to his hateful antisemitism - and Pacheo is right. The reason we know Pacheo is right is because his opinions are in line with the Living Magisterium. The reason we know you and Sungenis are wrong is because your opinions are not in line with the Living Magisterium. It really isn't complicated.

Your intellect and will (Sungenesis' also) do not supplant, only oppose, the Living Magisterium.

Only God could "revoke" what He establishes. Of course we humans can break the covenant. That is easy. It is also easy to oppose the authority established by the Triune God (You are doing it on these pages)but that doesn't mean the Divinely established authority is broken or revoked.

Now, you were wrong asserting the Pope taught Heaven wasn't a place and you are wrong about the Living Magisterium re the covenant not being revoked.

You have yet to post where it was revoked. I once read a helpful analogy. Maybe it will be helpful to you. When we go to College, we don't revoke our high school diploma.

Covenants are successive. They are made between ever-expanding groups of people. First, the covenant is between a couple, then a family, then a tribe, then a nation, then a country which rules other nations, and, finally, a univeral covenant including all peooples of all nations.

That does not mean all the previous covenants are revoked.

In other words, the Living Magisterium is right. You are wrong.

302 posted on 11/18/2004 6:05:26 AM PST by bornacatholic
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To: Tantumergo
The Book of Genesis

Chapter 17

The Covenant of circumcision.

1 And after he began to be ninety and nine years old, the Lord appeared to him: and said unto him: I am the Almighty God: walk before me, and be perfect.

2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee: and I will multiply thee exceedingly.

3 Abram fell flat on his face.

4 And God said to him: I am, and my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations.

5 Neither shall thy name be called any more Abram: but thou shalt be called Abraham: because I have made thee a father of many nations.

6 And I will make thee increase exceedingly, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee.

7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee, and between thy seed after thee in their generations, by a perpetual covenant: to be a God to thee, and to thy seed after thee. ...

303 posted on 11/18/2004 8:31:37 AM PST by bornacatholic
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To: Tantumergo
Sorry for the delayed response. It's always annoying when real life prevents one from freeping, especially when the subject matter has sparked a more intense interest.

Your quotes from scripture led me to immerse myself in Hebrews, since most came from there. I'm generally not impressed with verses excised from their content, and indeed, some you provided don't actually apply to the matter at hand, however, the general thrust of Hebrews does give the overall impression that the old covenant has been revoked, contrary to what the pope has been reported as saying in Mainz.

That the CCC uses the word "covenant" where, in context, it really means to say "testament", is an appalling gaff.

One commentary I read said that the Greek words "covenant" and "testament" are the same, which certainly doesn't aid in any quest for clarity. I'll concede your point for the meantime, but may return to the topic after more digging.

304 posted on 11/23/2004 7:01:54 PM PST by St.Chuck
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To: St.Chuck

"however, the general thrust of Hebrews does give the overall impression that the old covenant has been revoked, contrary to what the pope has been reported as saying in Mainz."

One thing that occurs to me is that when these words of the Pope are quoted, even in the Catechism, we are not given the full context of his speech. It is possible that the covenant which the Pope was referring to was the covenant with Abraham. This was a "unilateral" covenant sworn by God and was in no way dependent upon specific observances by Abraham or his descendants. Consequently it is quite correct to say that this covenant has not been revoked. If this is the case then the Pope was merely giving ambiguous and confusing messages in his speech.

However, in the NT and patristic sources the "Old Covenant" is the normative terminology for the covenant with Moses. It is through this covenant (subsequently revised and expanded in terms of the mitzvoh at Baal Peor cf. Deuteronomy) that Israel received the Mosaic Law - the defining aspect of "Jewishness" in NT times and cause of St. Paul's conflicts with the Judaisers which run throughout the NT from the Council of Jerusalem onwards. It is clearly this covenant that the book of Hebrews is addressing when it tells us that it has become obsolete and the old replaced by the new.

Unlike the Abrahamic covenant, this one was clearly "bilateral" in that, through Moses, God tells the people that IF they obey His commandments and ordinances THEN He will be their God and they will be His people. The consequences of their disobedience and violation of the covenant are laid out in Leviticus 26,14 onwards. Four times the Lord promises 7-fold curses upon them which are fulfilled in the destruction of Jerusalem and presaged by Jesus' 7-fold cursing of the Pharisees. The Apocalypse recounts the manifestation of the covenant curses in the guise of 1) 7 seals, 2) 7 Trumpets, 3) 7 Plagues, 4) 7 Cups of Wrath. The temple signifies the Old Covenant in space as the sabbath signifies it in time, and consequently the destruction of the temple signifies the end of the Old Covenant era as foreseen in the Apocalypse.

Of course the obsolescence of the Old does not imply an abandoning by God of the Jews - it is precisely for them in the first place that He gave the New Covenant in Christ as he promised in Jer 31,31.

However, the great danger in claiming that the Mosaic covenant is still valid is that it denies the work of Christ in creating the New, Universal and Everlasting Covenant which is for BOTH Jew and Gentile, slave and free, male and female, without distinction. If the Old Covenant was efficacious and salvific, then there was never any need for the New - we could all have attempted to earn our salvation by "works of the Law". But as St. Paul points out numerous times, there is no salvation in the Law - there was never meant to be!

The whole purpose of the Old was to give us Christ - now that He is here, He has brought us the New. As Hebrews says, the old is now obsolete, redundant, kaputt, finis!


305 posted on 11/24/2004 4:35:01 PM PST by Tantumergo
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