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The big five losers from 'The Passion'
Jerusalem Post ^ | 3.10.04

Posted on 03/10/2004 2:42:00 PM PST by ambrose

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To: RaceBannon
BUMP
101 posted on 03/10/2004 3:38:28 PM PST by Pan_Yans Wife (The soul unfolds itself, like a lotus of countless petals. --- Kahlil Gibran)
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To: NutCrackerBoy
Just what "hurt" do the Jews feel?

Some Jews are having "delusions of grandeur" in thinking THEY are responsible for Jesus' crucifixion because in reality WE ALL ARE...ALL PEOPLE, not just Jews!

102 posted on 03/10/2004 3:38:38 PM PST by Ann Archy (Abortion: The Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: Restorer
"Haven't seem Mel's movie yet, but I understand this is absolutely not the way the violence in it is handled."

You are absolutely correct.

1. They don't focus on the blows most of the time. The focus is on the other characters, and their responses, shown in their faces.
2. The focus for me was totally on Jesus. The "violence" -- I don't think of it that way at all, I think of it merely AS the Passion of Christ! Hard to explain. I saw Jesus' determination to defeat the temptations of the Satan in the opening scene (who taunted that He could not take upon himself all sins of humanity -- it was altogether TOO MUCH); as he repeatedly tried to stand up at the scourging pillar. See the faces of some of the Romans as He does this, resolutely and determinedly, to TAKE the punishment, not to shrink from it. The camera is not continually on the back, the blows, not at all. The FOCUS is certainly on the dignity and determination with which Jesus EMBRACED his Passion. The love, the generosity.

I will go so far to say that it is not a "violent" film AT ALL -- in the usual sense of the word. It is simply sublime.
103 posted on 03/10/2004 3:39:12 PM PST by AMDG&BVMH
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To: veronica
Wanna retract your comment??

Well, no. Cal Thomas mentions in passing that Frank Rich was at the performance, and his significance is as a drama critic. As a political columnist, Frank Rich is the worst of the worst, and he is to be mentioned only to be condemned.

104 posted on 03/10/2004 3:40:51 PM PST by Plutarch
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To: feinswinesuksass
This author also seems to dispute that the jews did kill Jesus....as did the romans....

I too dispute that "the jews" (and "the romans") killed Jesus. Some Jews, and some Romans. Not "the".

This is always the sticking point I have with Passion detractors. They can't seem to tell the difference between "some" and "the".

105 posted on 03/10/2004 3:41:15 PM PST by Dr. Frank fan
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To: Plutarch
In what manner has Frank Rich passed himself off as political columnist in regards to The Passion?

And I happen to know he and Cal Thomas are friends. They are both theater junkies. Cal Thomas wrote glowingly of a book on theater that Frank Rich wrote years ago.

That's the thing about grown-ups. They can respectfully disagree on some things, still be friends, and not hurl invective at each other like so many schoolyard brats.

106 posted on 03/10/2004 3:46:39 PM PST by veronica ("America will never seek a permission slip to defend the security of our people." GW Bush 1-20-04)
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To: ambrose
It could be argued that Mel Gibson already did The Passion. Just the names/dates/places were changed.

And the persecution of innocent English has resonated ever since, great point.

(ducking out for cover now)

Typical.

107 posted on 03/10/2004 3:49:17 PM PST by PeoplesRep_of_LA (Treason doth never prosper, for if it does, none dare call it treason)
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To: ambrose
I disagree with every single point SHMULEY BOTEACH makes.
They sound contrived and manufactured, and betray his resentment of the enormous success of the Passion and Mel Gibson.
108 posted on 03/10/2004 3:51:29 PM PST by Jorge
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To: kevkrom
I agree, great post!


109 posted on 03/10/2004 3:52:48 PM PST by PeoplesRep_of_LA (Treason doth never prosper, for if it does, none dare call it treason)
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To: ambrose
"Christian conservatives whose ability to protest violence in Hollywood films has now been severely compromised."

This guy is a "writer" of 14 books, but he doesn't understand the meaning of words.

Conservatives "ability to protest" has not been compromised at all, especially severely. The point he may be trying to make, wrong as it is, is that their credibility to protest that has been compromised.

Schumley's writing skills have been severely compromised.

110 posted on 03/10/2004 3:54:03 PM PST by HighWheeler (RATS hero is an impeached, dis-barred, lying, perjuring, cheating, lazy, cowardly sexual predator)
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Mark for later read
111 posted on 03/10/2004 3:56:05 PM PST by SpookBrat
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To: veronica; Plutarch
That's the thing about grown-ups. They can respectfully disagree on some things, still be friends, and not hurl invective at each other like so many schoolyard brats.

Good advice...for Frank Rich. Have you read any of his collumns attacking this movie, those involved and those who support it personally going back a year and a half?

I can link you to Frank Rich collumns if you were unaware of the infantile meltdown this writer has published for the world to see.

112 posted on 03/10/2004 3:57:37 PM PST by PeoplesRep_of_LA (Treason doth never prosper, for if it does, none dare call it treason)
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To: HighWheeler
Have you noticed lately the habit of Libs to cloak themselves as Republicans or conservatives before they spew some liberal bogus charge or other stupid remark?

The use of the word 'authentic' is a dead give-away - that's one of the favorite words of the marxist left.

113 posted on 03/10/2004 3:59:47 PM PST by technochick99
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To: ambrose
Boteach forgot to include the biggest loser: people like himself. He, Foxman, Rich were hungering desperately for some kind of outbreak of anti-Semitism, especially anti-Semitic violence, following release of "The Passion."

Nothing bad has happened, despite the hysterically hyperbolic predictions of Foxman and crew. Nothing bad will happen, notwithstanding hypocritically pious sanctimony like Boteach's. Nobody's going to pay any more attention to any of these bunch of losers.

114 posted on 03/10/2004 4:01:31 PM PST by Map Kernow ("I hold that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing" ---Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Ann Archy
Jews ... thinking THEY are responsible for Jesus' crucifixion because in reality WE ALL ARE...ALL PEOPLE, not just Jews!

Clearly Jews who feel hurt do not accept the truth of that. Manifestly, no Jew accepts the divinity of Christ, that he died for ALL our sins. Without that interpretation, The Passion of the Christ is nothing more nor less than the old charge of deicide. Jews have been persecuted and died as a result of Jew-hatred and/or the deicide charge.

115 posted on 03/10/2004 4:02:19 PM PST by NutCrackerBoy
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To: technochick99
Thanks chick, for that lib-check. I'll watch for the word "authentic". Libs don't have a big vocabulary, so any key word search is usually easy.
116 posted on 03/10/2004 4:05:46 PM PST by HighWheeler (RATS hero is an impeached, dis-barred, lying, perjuring, cheating, lazy, cowardly sexual predator)
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To: ambrose
It is time for all of us, both Christian and Jew, to confront our differences in an honest and responsible way.

Jews, who do not subscribe to the divinity of Christ, and who have a long history of being the victims of pogroms and persecutions, view this movie differently from those of us who understand Jesus as a blood scarifice for all mankind. It is not out of malice, but simply from their different view of history.

Christians viewing this movie cannot understand why Jews don't understand that we view the people in Jerusalem as an emblem for all mankind, and that Christ took our place in order to save us from our sins.

Both sides need to make an honest attempt to understand the other side. When Mona Charen and Charles Krauthammer, who have been loyal allies in the cultural and political wars, are trashed because of their opinions on this movie, those of us who are Christians need to stop and ask WHY they have that opinion.

And people like Charen and Krauthammer need to ask themselves why many of their loyal readers love this movie.

It is obvious to me that the Jewish community carries fears handed down from generations of persecution. It is also obvious that those of us in the Christian community don't understand Jewish thinking on this.

Rather than getting into a full-blown war with our friends, I think we should each make an effort to explain our differences and our similarities, and also attempt to maintain respect and civility. Calm discussion will do more to assuage fears of the Jewish community than attacks. And calm discussion from the Jewish community will do more to make friendship with Christians than attacks on the movie.

117 posted on 03/10/2004 4:07:55 PM PST by Miss Marple
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To: ambrose
Has it opened yet in Israel? I hope it does soon so they can see for themselves just how destructive this liberal pap is. I'm sure that's exactly why they are doing it. They are hoping to put a wedge between the Christian community and the Jewish community. Can't lose those sure fire democrat votes, so what if they endanger Israel.
118 posted on 03/10/2004 4:14:48 PM PST by McGavin999 (Evil thrives when good men do nothing!)
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To: ambrose
What a pantload. Let me take a stab at each, and then offer my own list of losers.

1. Christian conservatives whose ability to protest violence in Hollywood films has now been severely compromised.
No, for any number of reasons. I will give one practical (and not particularly worthy), and one logical.

On the practical level, if Christian conservatives do protest violence in Hollywood films in the future, they (we) will be accused of hypocrisy.

So what else is new? That is always what we are accused of. Dog bites man, film at 11.

And the logical reason- Christian conservatives have always spoken out about gratuitous violence. Violence depicted as cool, or fun. The glorification of abhorrent behavior. The Passion does not depict violence as cool. Or fun. Or admirable. It depicts it as man's fall.

2. Mel Gibson, who emerges as a talented fanatic at best and a full-blown loon at worst.
And the millions who have gone to see his work are fanatics and full blown loons? While part of me wants to say there is no way that so large a proportion of America are nuts, part of me remembers that a large proportion of America thinks Al Gore would have made a fine President.
3. Jewish conservatives, many of whom now feel alienated from their Christian colleagues and are wondering who are their authentic allies.
I'll admit, having read Krauthammer, Masons, Charen, Frum and a few others, that they probably do think this way. The question is, should they? They warned about the antisemitism and where it would lead. Where is the evidence? Where is the vandalism, the violence against Jews, anything? If there has been any, it hasn't been above what there normally (and tragically) is.

Jewish conservatives feared the worst of their Christian allies. They should be realizing that they underestimated us.

4. Jews for Jesus.
There was no coherent argument made for this one, and as such I can provide no defense.
5. The Christian faith. The biggest loser of all, tragically, is the Christian religion, which is now portrayed as a religion of blood, gore, and death rather than of blessing, love, and life.
I wish the writer would make up his mind. I thought the film was antisemitic because it portrayed Jews as bloodthirsty. In reality it shows the Christian religion to be bloodthirsty? Who knew?

OK, here's my list of losers.

1. Anti-Christian bigots.

End of list.

119 posted on 03/10/2004 4:15:12 PM PST by William McKinley
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To: Miss Marple
Rather than getting into a full-blown war with our friends, I think we should each make an effort to explain our differences and our similarities, and also attempt to maintain respect and civility. Calm discussion will do more to assuage fears of the Jewish community than attacks. And calm discussion from the Jewish community will do more to make friendship with Christians than attacks on the movie.

Words of wisdom

120 posted on 03/10/2004 4:15:40 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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