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But Is Mel Gibson Catholic?
Pangaeus ^
Posted on 01/11/2004 5:56:57 AM PST by NYer
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1
posted on
01/11/2004 5:56:58 AM PST
by
NYer
To: american colleen; sinkspur; Lady In Blue; Salvation; Polycarp; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; redhead; ...
But, according to The New York Times Magazine, the actors privately funded Church of the Holy Family in Malibu is not affiliated with any diocese. So, according to Church law, its schismatic, not a Catholic church at all. Gibson's church may prove to be far more controversial than his film. An interesting perspective, by a canon lawyer, on the extent of traditionalism.
2
posted on
01/11/2004 6:00:49 AM PST
by
NYer
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To: NYer
Since 1993, more than 80 percent of the Catholic bishops in the United States have been directly implicated in court cases of priestly pedophilia or in using their positions to shield such activity over the past 40 years or more, according to a study compiled by reporters Brooks Egerton and Reese Dunklin of the Dallas Morning News last year. A little background would be helpful here. Some time ago, sinkspur had posted an uncomplemenatary article about Fr. Groeschel, written by this reporter. I did a little googling, and found out that this is no ordinary reporter; he is chairman of the Texas chapter of the National Lesbian and Gay Journalists.
So, when he refers to all of these cases as "pedophilia," (which some of them undoubtedly are) instead of "homosexual," (which most of them undoubtedly are) recognize that he may have an agenda in so doing.
And with a little effort, he says, "you can get a Latin Mass celebrated regularly at your proper parish, and know that you're doing so in full communion with the Church that really is almost 2000 years old."
Ha!
If it were that simple, I don't think we'd have schismatic groups setting up their own chapels.
4
posted on
01/11/2004 6:25:18 AM PST
by
B Knotts
(Go 'Nucks!)
To: sinkspur
I guess I should ping you on this, as I mentioned your name, although it was simply in the context of a historical explanation, rather than an attack on you. :-)
5
posted on
01/11/2004 6:26:52 AM PST
by
B Knotts
(Go 'Nucks!)
To: NYer
A better question is whether the Novus Ordo Church is Catholic. Rome has a problem--and it's a huge one. People like Gibson have more real faith and credibility than the legions of corrupt bishops the Pope has himself appointed to be our "spiritual shepherds."
To: B Knotts
Good ferreting!
7
posted on
01/11/2004 6:58:14 AM PST
by
Salvation
(†With God all things are possible.†)
To: NYer
I understood that Gibson was Catholic but was attending an SPPX church.
Is my memory askew here?
8
posted on
01/11/2004 6:59:02 AM PST
by
Salvation
(†With God all things are possible.†)
To: NYer
Then, again, The Catholic Church did not exist at the point in time described by Gibson's movie.
It is as it was.
9
posted on
01/11/2004 8:28:22 AM PST
by
Mike Darancette
(Proud member - Neoconservative Power Vortex)
To: B Knotts
Case in point is the "exile" of Father Weinberger by the bishops of Dallas. Father was doing nothing more than what he is allowed to by right. Saying the mass as prescribed by Rome, that is to say in its offical Latin version. Maybe they didn't like the fact that he wore a biretta?
10
posted on
01/11/2004 8:41:18 AM PST
by
RobbyS
(XPqu)
To: Mike Darancette
Well, technically the Christian Church did not come into existence until Pentecost.
11
posted on
01/11/2004 8:43:14 AM PST
by
RobbyS
(XPqu)
To: Salvation
I understood that Gibson was Catholic but was attending an SPPX church. No, your memory is not askew ;-D
According to Orthodox News (http://www.orthodoxnews.netfirms.com/Mel%20Gibson%20Is.htm)
"Gibson and his son, the star of blockbuster films like "Braveheart" and "Lethal Weapon," are practitioners of an ultraconservative Catholic movement known as traditionalism. The small splinter group seeks to revive orthodox practices that were abandoned several centuries ago by mainstream Catholicism.
The actor has been especially forthcoming about his religious affiliation recently. Gibson is building a traditionalist church on a 9,300-square-foot complex in Malibu, Calif., for about 70 members, the Times said. He is serving as the director, chief executive officer and sole benefactor of the church, which intends to conduct its Sunday Mass entirely in Latin. The property was purchased by a church group called Holy Family."
No need for Roger Cardinal Mahoney to feel threatened ... lol.
12
posted on
01/11/2004 10:12:36 AM PST
by
NYer
To: Salvation
I understood that Gibson was Catholic but was attending an SPPX church.What's wrong with that? Monsignor Perle says it's OK.
To: NYer
No, your memory is not askew ;-DI'm missing something. Where does your quote mention that Gibson attends SSPX Masses?
To: Salvation; NYer
I thought his Father attended a traditionalist Church, but not SSPX. And I have never heard Mr. Gibson claim he was not in communion with the Roman Catholic Church, or part of another group. We have to watch what the media implies.
15
posted on
01/11/2004 10:41:24 AM PST
by
nickcarraway
(www.terrisfight.org)
To: NYer
Vatican II--officially the Second Vatican Council...mandating simplification of the liturgy and the use of the local vernacular languages instead of Latin everywhere.For an associate of the Canon Law society, this jerk is clueless.
To: NYer
But, according to The New York Times Magazine, the actors privately funded Church of the Holy Family in Malibu is not affiliated with any diocese. So, according to Church law, its schismatic, not a Catholic church at all.So, according to this offer, all churches run by Jesuits, Benedictines, Franciscans, Carmelites, etc. is schismatic? According to this writer, while I attended Santa clara University and often went to Mass there, I was a schismatic for four years? I never realized or intended to that. Everyone at Notre Dame, Boston College, Georgetown, etc, is a schismatic?
17
posted on
01/11/2004 10:44:51 AM PST
by
nickcarraway
(www.terrisfight.org)
To: NYer
This is the next phase of the attack on Mel.
We don't know who the priest is who serves Mel's chapel. He could be SSPX or another priest with valid orders. Just because he isn't affiliated with Mahony doesn't make him schismatic (rather I think it's a badge of honor, but I digress).
There are retired priests and priests without parishes who are allowed to say valid Masses outside of parish buildings. This shouldn't be a judgement of schism.
Mel's chapel is probably one of the most Catholic places in southern California.
To: NYer
The wife and I saw the preview for The Passion yesterday. We are definitely going to see this movie!
19
posted on
01/11/2004 10:49:40 AM PST
by
Eala
(Sacrificing tagline fame for... TRAD ANGLICAN RESOURCE PAGE: http://eala.freeservers.com/anglican)
To: NYer; nickcarraway
Kevin Orlin Johnson, Ph.D....raises some serious issues about the actor's relationship with the Catholic Church.
Looking at the responses, I feel better about not being "enlightened" by this news piece.
Is Mel in schism or not looks to be the unanswered question.
Reflecting back upon Mel Gibson's EWTN interview, there's nothing that stands out as an answer to that. Wouldn't Arroyo have raised that issue? I do recall Arroyo's comment "you and I share a love of the Tridentine rite", and Gibson's daily mass attendance being "detergent for the soul". There was not much beyond that IIRC.
I will *definitely* tune into the next interview on January 23rd.
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