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To: airedale
The best books I know of to understand what the church was like that Christ established when he was on earth are the Bible and The Book of Mormon. Both are scripture. Both testify that Jesus is the Christ and that His atonement was offered freely, by Him, for everyone who has ever, does now, or will ever live on the earth.

As a Mormon, I felt totally incapable of fully living the tenets of the church in my late teens. I didn't go to church for 20 years, led a worldly life, and realized at the end of that 20 years that life without Christ as my example was less than what I wanted it to be. During that 20 year absence I even went to see the film "The God Makers" to validate my inactivity in church. What happened surprised me. I realized that there were blatant untruths in that movie. Oddly enough, it was kind of the catalyst for my return to Mormonism.

All I can tell you is that reading books written by men with varying viewpoints will do nothing but confuse you. In the Book of Mormon there is a scripture that states that if you want to know if the book is true, you read it and then pray to know if it is true. For those who sincerely want to know, the Holy Ghost will manifest the truth.

I don't wish to caste dispersions on other religions, or tell another Christian church that they are not Christians because they don't believe exactly as I do. I think that most churches do a tremendous amount of good. But, the Holy Ghost, or Holy Spirit is a comforter and a testifier of the truth. I have had countless personal experiences that have strengthened my testimony of Christ and His divine mission.

At this time of year I think of how God, the Eternal Father, sent his only begotten son to die for us that we all might live eternally with Him again.

Can you imagine what it would be like to be surrounded by people who have really internalized Christ's message - to love everyone as He loves us? No dishonesty, jealousy, bigotry, or vice of any kind in anyone's heart? That, to me, is Christ's message for us.

I hope you have a wonderful Christmas.

728 posted on 12/24/2003 6:09:44 PM PST by luvtheconstitution
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To: luvtheconstitution
Both are scripture.

And, if JS had LEFT it at that, we probably would NOT be having this discussion today.

But, as we all know, he glommed a lot MORE stuff into Mormonism, calling IT scripture.


THAT'S the things we are 'discussing' here.
731 posted on 12/24/2003 7:54:27 PM PST by Elsie (When the avalanche starts... it's too late for the pebbles to vote....)
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To: luvtheconstitution
Satan is STILL using the same line he started with........





Genesis 3:1
...."Did God really say........?"

Because it is STILL effective!



If one does NOT know the TRUE words of GOD, then a subsitute can be followed quite easily.

The Bible shows that god spoke to ADAM about the tree.

Did Adam fail to accurately tell EVE?
Did he ADD a little -- 'or touch it' -- to be SURE she didn't mess with it??

(We KNOW that men are ALWAYS trying to help GOD out...)

All we REALLY know is that by the time she repeated the command to Satan, it was different.

"Are you sure?" was enough to form doubts in her mind, and we ALL know 'the REST of the Story'!
732 posted on 12/24/2003 8:02:48 PM PST by Elsie (When the avalanche starts... it's too late for the pebbles to vote....)
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To: luvtheconstitution
I'm glad you returned to your faith. That can only make the world a better place and you a much better individual. I have a number of friends who are Mormon and they are great people who are strong in their beliefs. A few years ago my wife attended a dinner for Mr. Gordon Hinckley and all the Church of the Later Day Saints had done for the poor and needy in the Los Angeles area. She said he was very impressive. The award was justified. The various Stakes do a lot here in the San Fernando Valley to help the needy.

Unfortunately theology is a very difficult subject and deals with a lot of subtleties. The difference between one denomination and another might be one or two issues in some cases and others it’s a much larger chasm. Follow this link to a brief description of the differences between Protestants and Catholics.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12495a.htm The issues are accurate but it only gives the Catholic arguments. It’s also a generality since some of the points of dispute don’t apply to all Protestant denominations. That section is long enough already.

The arguments are complex and often seem to be dealing with trivia, but they are the foundation stones and if you don’t get them laid correctly everything built on that foundation will be different than you intended at the beginning. For most of us these differences don’t matter or we don’t know why they are important.

I’m a Methodist and I an not allowed to take Communion in a Catholic Church because I’m not a Catholic (decision of Catholic Church). There are enough differences that the Catholic Church while it does recognize me as a Christian I’m not in a state of Grace that allows me to partake in the Sacrament. A Catholic would be welcome at our Communion service, but the Catholic Church would frown on their participating for the same reason that they wouldn’t want me taking Communion in a Catholic service. For years the various Christian denominations have been seeking a way to iron out this problem without much progress. The theological and historical differences are to great.

Take a look at what the Church of the Latter Day Saints teaches about God, Jesus and the Holy Sprit and compare it to the Trinity. The Trinity is one of the keystones to Christianity and all Christian faiths essentially believe the same thing. I think you’ll find that the concept of the Trinity is substantially different than your church teaches.

Another is in the nature of God.

Saying that Mormons aren’t Christian isn’t disparaging it in my eyes. It’s a statement that stands on facts. It’s no different than saying that The Church of the Latter Day Saint is a Christian Church. What positions do the facts support. It's at this point in theology starts to deal with the foundational doctrines and split hairs. It’s an extremely complicated subject which each word can be and have been fought over.

The problem is that your church teaches that the Church of the Latter Day Saints is a Christian church and the rest of the Christian denominations don’t accept that view. The Church of the Latter Day Saints view that they are a Christian faith is a matter of doctrine for your church and becuase it's a matter of doctrine it's almost impossible for you to accept a different position.

From the United Methodist this link will take you to a statement on the Methodist position which is in the Book of Discipline (rules for Methodist Church): http://www.umns.umc.org/gc2000news/stories/gc052.htm Part of it states:

"The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, by self-definition, does not fit within the bounds of the historic, apostolic tradition of Christian faith," delegates said.

While the Mormons identify themselves as Christian, they also "explicitly (profess) distinction and separateness from the ecumenical community," delegates said. Mormons are intentional about clarifying differences in doctrine, the delegates noted. "

I pulled the following from a BBC site which highlights some of the major points of difference. The differences are important since just about everything you and I believe are based upon these things. http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/mormon/features/christianity.shtml

• The Trinity
o Other Christians believe that God is a single entity consisting of 3 persons.
o Mormons believe that God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost are separate beings who together make up the Godhead.

• God
o Other Christians believe that God is a spiritual being who has existed for ever, and has never changed.
o Mormons believe that both God the Father and Jesus Christ were once mortal men who became gods.

o Other Christians believe that God has no body and is only spirit.
o Mormons believe that God has a physical body.

o Other Christians believe that there is only one God.
o Mormons believe that there are many gods in many universes.
o Mormons believe that human beings can eventually grow to become gods themselves.

• Jesus Christ
o Other Christians believe that Jesus Christ was conceived without sexual intercourse through the intervention of the Holy Ghost.
o Mormons believe that Jesus Christ is the physical son of God the Father.

• The Church
o Other Christians believe that the conventional Christian churches are the true representation of the historical tradition of Christianity.
o Mormons believe that their church is the 'restoration' of true Christianity.

• Scripture
o Other Christians believe that the scripture consists of the Bible.
o Mormons believe that the scripture consists of the Bible plus the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants




740 posted on 12/25/2003 4:44:45 PM PST by airedale
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