Gibson's gaffe. Mel Gibson needs to take a history class.

Jewsweek ^ | 7/31/03 | Regenstein

[DPB101]

Gibson's gaffe. Mel Gibson needs to take a history class. It was the Romans, not the Jews, who were the Christ killers.

The flood of recent articles and publicity on Mel Gibson's forthcoming movie on Jesus' crucifixion have failed to mention the most important point about this controversy: if the movie does tell the truth about the cruelty and brutality of Jesus' crucifixion, it will make it clear that it was the Romans, not the Jews, who are the real "Christ killers".

According to the Christian Bible ( the "New Testament", especially the Gospel of Mark), Jesus, his family, and virtually all of his followers and disciples at the time were Jews. Jesus preached almost exclusively to the Jews ("the multitudes"), who dined and walked with him. It was his popularity with the Jewish people that caused Jesus to be killed by the ruling Roman authorities; and it was Jews who took Jesus off the cross, prepared him for "burial," mourned him, and then got the blame for the crime.

While a small clique of Jewish collaborators in the ruling classes are purported to have urged the Romans on, they had no real political power, all of which was held by the ruling Romans. All accounts make it clear that it was Romans who condemned Jesus to death, tortured him, put a crown of thorns on his head, spat on him, crucified him, even ran him through with a sword, fearing that this popular Jewish reformer with a huge Jewish following was a threat to Roman law and order.

The Romans went on to kill Jesus' closest disciples Peter and Paul, along with countless other Jewish "Christians", and eventually killed or expelled from the region almost all of the Jews, thus setting the stage for 2,000 years of Jewish suffering and persecution, and for the violence and territorial disputes that plague the Holy Land today.

It is unfortunate that Gibson's movie will apparently fail to make it clear who really killed Jesus, and instead will repeat the ancient blood libels that actually contradict the New Testament's account of the murder, and which have been used since that time to stir up hatred for Jesus' own people.

Indeed, the New Testament account of these events could be used to discredit Gibson's movie, which he claims is based on the truthful version of events as set forth in the Christian bible.

[Rightwing Conspiratr1]

New Testament Revisonist Bump

[nmh]

The Romans carried out the wishes of the Jews. Pontious Pilate "washed" his hands of the matter. SO what's the big deal with that? Does that mean I view all Jews as Jesus killers? No, because in the Bible, God determined that the Jews would reject the Messiah and Jesus would be the ultimate sacrafice for us so we could all go to heaven if we believe in Jesus. I'm grateful this happened otherwise I wouldn't be a candidate for heaven. He paid my price and that IS what is important.

[nmh]

My, my, your source - "Jewsweek ^ | 7/31/03 | Regenstein" ... . Another Jewish person and an extremely Jewish paperblaming the Romans ... . Geesh!

[adam_az]

hint:

Most Jews are not up on the finer details of Christian theology. That might have something to do for it.

Also, to Jews, many Christian rituals with Pagan origins are seen as just that, such as ritual consumption of replacement blood (the wine) commemorating the sacrifice of your messiah since to Jews blood is strictly not kosher, in fact meat is salted and drained of all blood as part of the koshering ritual. Also, in Jewish halacha (law), no one is responsible for the sins of someone else, which to Jews contradicts Christian theology that Jesus died for your sins.

This isn't criticism, just a braindump of my understanding what Jews and Christians both believe and what they know about each other, at least in my experience.

[HughSeries]

It was our sin that killed Jesus.

So sin gets the credit for God's glorious work of redemption.

That's pretty twisted. And unbelievable arrogance, masked in pious humility.

[adam_az]

Many Jews have heard (I have, personally, once) from Christians that the Jews killed Jesus and don't understand in Christian theology that "Jesus died for your sins" means that Christians believe EVERYONE killed Jesus, and bears equal responsibility, because of their sins.

Most Jews think it means that Christians believe "Jesus died for my sins, and those Jewish bastards killed him!"

This is understandable from European descended Jews because the relations between Christian countries and Jewish citizens often involved ghettos, pogroms, inquisitions, military draft, and expulsion.

[ETERNAL WARMING]

It was the Romans, not the Jews, who were the Christ killers

Wrong. The choice was given to the Jewish religious leaders. THEY were the ones who are responsible for the death of Jesus Christ.

[rmlew]

1. I hate to tell you, but Jesus did commit blasphemy.
2. As for the "Jewish leaders" these were puppets for the Romans. Had Jesus not been killed on Passover (against JUewish law), been a threat to the Romans and their puppets, you might have a case.

[quietolong]

Here’s a Jewish group that says they did us all a favor.

Who Was Jesus?

I don't think it's Mel Gibson who needs to take a history class

[rmlew]

Claiming to be the Son of God is blaspheme accoding to the books of Moses.
There were good reasons to condemn Jesus. However, he was killed for Political reasons after he claimed to be the Messia, making himself a threat to Rome and its puppets.

[quietolong]

If you need to look something up.

Bible Search

[rmlew]

Who were "the Jews" if not the collaborationist Sanhedrin and appointed Jewish officials.
There were plenty of blashpemers in 30CE, i only know of one who was killed.
By claiming to be the Messiah, Jesus threatened Roman rule and the collaborationist power structure. It was these elements that killed him.

[King Prout]

yes?
like what?
It is late, I am tired, my shift ended 30 minutes ago, and I want to go home.
And there's a lot of stuff on that page.
Are you referring to Luke 23:13-18?

[rmlew]

real believable scene.
That the Christians had the most to gain by blaiming Jews in their quest to convert gentiles had nothing to do with recollections 25 years later?

[King Prout]

nevermind - I missed the "If..."
like I said - I'm tired :)
thanks for the resource.

[Swordmaker]

Ultimately, I believe that if a Christian is confronted with the question "Who Crucified Christ?" the appropriate answer is "I did."

I, Petronski, crucified Christ.

But, Hallelujah, He saves.

Jesus said, from the cross, "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do."

He forgave you and me... and everyone else involved in his crucifixion.

[rmlew]

Jesus road throwugh Damascus gate on an ass. He called himself king of the Jews.
You might not accept it, but in the context of the time, it was a political statement that he was ruler.
That was a threat to the Roman occupiers, their Edomite Tetrarchs, and the Hellenistic collaborators placed on the Sanhedrin by the former.
Had the issue been blaspheme (of which Jesus was guilty) he would have been ignored, like hundreds of other "prophets". It was on the overt political and religious act of claiming to be the Messiah that made Jesus a threat and separated him from those who were ignored.
Those are historical facts. Everything esle is based on not unbiased recollections years after the facts.

[quietolong]

>>>> I don't have my Bible with me (at work) >>>>

Anything in the Bible you may want to look up.

[rwfromkansas]

What BS. As if this writer has no agenda?

The Jewish religious leaders were very much active in attempting to "get" Jesus all through his life, even to the very end.

It wasn't Romans who screamed "crucify him!"

[quietolong]

That's ok Now Go home and have a good night rest.