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Gibson's gaffe. Mel Gibson needs to take a history class.
Jewsweek ^
| 7/31/03
| Regenstein
Posted on 07/30/2003 8:19:47 PM PDT by DPB101
Gibson's gaffe. Mel Gibson needs to take a history class. It was the Romans, not the Jews, who were the Christ killers.
The flood of recent articles and publicity on Mel Gibson's forthcoming movie on Jesus' crucifixion have failed to mention the most important point about this controversy: if the movie does tell the truth about the cruelty and brutality of Jesus' crucifixion, it will make it clear that it was the Romans, not the Jews, who are the real "Christ killers".
According to the Christian Bible ( the "New Testament", especially the Gospel of Mark), Jesus, his family, and virtually all of his followers and disciples at the time were Jews. Jesus preached almost exclusively to the Jews ("the multitudes"), who dined and walked with him. It was his popularity with the Jewish people that caused Jesus to be killed by the ruling Roman authorities; and it was Jews who took Jesus off the cross, prepared him for "burial," mourned him, and then got the blame for the crime.
While a small clique of Jewish collaborators in the ruling classes are purported to have urged the Romans on, they had no real political power, all of which was held by the ruling Romans. All accounts make it clear that it was Romans who condemned Jesus to death, tortured him, put a crown of thorns on his head, spat on him, crucified him, even ran him through with a sword, fearing that this popular Jewish reformer with a huge Jewish following was a threat to Roman law and order.
The Romans went on to kill Jesus' closest disciples Peter and Paul, along with countless other Jewish "Christians", and eventually killed or expelled from the region almost all of the Jews, thus setting the stage for 2,000 years of Jewish suffering and persecution, and for the violence and territorial disputes that plague the Holy Land today.
It is unfortunate that Gibson's movie will apparently fail to make it clear who really killed Jesus, and instead will repeat the ancient blood libels that actually contradict the New Testament's account of the murder, and which have been used since that time to stir up hatred for Jesus' own people.
Indeed, the New Testament account of these events could be used to discredit Gibson's movie, which he claims is based on the truthful version of events as set forth in the Christian bible.
TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: acts236; barabus; catholiclist; gibson; passion
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1
posted on
07/30/2003 8:19:48 PM PDT
by
DPB101
To: DPB101
I actually thought it was the religious leaders who condemn jesus to death thru the crowds and the romans who up held jewish law.
I don't know I maybe wrong won't be the first time, but if that is not the case I will stand corrected quite quickly.
2
posted on
07/30/2003 8:21:55 PM PDT
by
dts32041
(So how do you like taxation with representation?)
To: DPB101
Lewis Regenstein is author of "Replenish the Earth: The Teachings of the World's Religions on Protecting Animals and Nature" and president of the Interfaith Council for the Protection of Animals and Nature.
To: DPB101
This guy has nothing to worry about. The ADL and the ad hoc Catholic bishop's group disliked the movie because it too closely followed the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. They much prefer a watered-down, modern interpretation.
To: DPB101
The hostilities towards this movie only increases the desire of people to see it. I remember when the "Last Temptation Of Christ" came out and all the uproar added to the hype and the box office boost.
Israel is in need of support from the American Jewish community and this is what the people at Jewsweek are spending their time doing?
I will reserve my opinion of Mel Gibson until I've seen the movie. If he's wrong, then I'll say so. If he's not, I wonder if Jewsweek would say so.
5
posted on
07/30/2003 8:25:57 PM PDT
by
MoJo2001
To: DPB101
This guy needs a reading comprehension course.
6
posted on
07/30/2003 8:27:14 PM PDT
by
Varda
To: dts32041
The Jewish leaders were the ones who captured him and led him away. He was tried before their tribunal before being sent to Pilot.
7
posted on
07/30/2003 8:30:29 PM PDT
by
irishtenor
(My God is omnipotent, sorry about yours. *** Swarming Calvinists Unite!***)
To: DPB101
Yes - didn't Pilate declare that there was no cause to bring charges against Jesus? And the crowds, most likely spurred on by the chief priests and teachers of the law, shouted ,"Crucify! Crucify!".
To: DPB101
Indeed, the New Testament account of these events could be used to discredit Gibson's movie, which he claims is based on the truthful version of events as set forth in the Christian bible. Since Lewis Regenstein has no qualms about referencing the New Testament, if really wants to get a grip on reality he should ponder the meaning of the term "the stone which the builders rejected." And then meditate on the parable of the master who sent his servant out to gather travelers and beggars from the countryside for a feast, after all the master's friends turned down his invitation.
To: DPB101
Jewsweek,New Testament?
I'm so confused.
10
posted on
07/30/2003 8:32:13 PM PDT
by
mdittmar
To: dts32041
No, While they screamed and moaned to have Christ killed, there was not ONE law from Moses that concemnded Jesus.
Most points this guy made were right on, but he left out how th first people who killed Christians were Jews in Jerusalem, Stephen. Led by the future Apostle Paul.
To: dts32041
I actually thought it was the religious leaders who condemn jesus to death thru the crowds and the romans who up held jewish law. Yes, indeed. The religious leaders of the Jews wanted to get rid of Jesus. They didn't want to have his blood on their hands, especially at the high holiday of Passover, so they petitioned the Roman rulers to carry out the task for them on trumped up charges (sedition or insurrection, I think, will have to check Bible - computer probs tonight, no links) and got the crowds all fired up. The crowds were waiting for the Romans to give amnesty to and release a prisoner - Barrabas, as the Romans always granted this amnesty release during the high holidays, kind of like appeasement. The Roman rulers were reluctant, because questioning with Pilate did not reveal wrongdoing, but they were eager to avoid a riot. Seems like both groups played a part. The Romans carried out the actual crucifixion, as they routinely used such methods to punish criminals.
12
posted on
07/30/2003 8:34:08 PM PDT
by
fortunecookie
(longtime lurker and new poster)
Comment #13 Removed by Moderator
To: dts32041
that's the way I recall it, too. I don't have my Bible with me (at work) but I'm pretty sure that the Pharisees are the ones who corralled Jesus, tried him, condemned him, and then turned him over to Pilate for execution.
None of which is or should ever be taken as license for calling Jews "christ-killers" or anything like that - the author correctly pointed out that Jesus et alia were themselves Jews. Moreover, of course, how are modern Jews accountable for the acts of the Pharisees 1970 years ago? That's worse than holding the modern white descendants of dirt-poor yeomanry accountable for the institution of slavery from 140 years ago.
I am curious as to why the author is so... eager to wail? exercised? about this issue - no one with a brain these days takes the old "blood libel" seriously.
14
posted on
07/30/2003 8:36:05 PM PDT
by
King Prout
(people hear and do not listen, see and do not observe, speak without thought, post and not edit)
To: DPB101
'Twas I Lord Jesus I Crucified thee.
My Sin!
Our Sin!
To: DPB101
It was the Jews who insisted the Romans try Jesus, as they had not the legal power to condemn him to death.
Neither Pilate nor Agrippa wanted the case. The Jewish crowd would not accept Barrabas as an alternative...they insisted that Jesus be the one crucified.
To: Varda
This is the second article I've seen on from this publication critizing this movie. I can sort of understand their concern, but it's seriously time to *see* the bloody movie before anymore ink gets spilled.
To: DPB101
Read further. It gets good.
To: DPB101
It seems to me the responsibility for Jesus's cruxificition is shared between the Roman and Jewish leaders of the time in Israel. Exactly, how much of the blame each deserves is really beyond what we know from the accounts written, and really a moot point.
The fact that some Jews...and some Romans...killed Christ does not tarnish either group today in anyway, and no one, Gibson or otherwise, is trying to make this out to be the case.
From the multitude of angry liberals arguing against the point, you'd think they'd have bothered to see if anyone was actually making the argument in the first place...but then that would get in their way of smearing what sounds to be a truly moving religious film.
To: classmuse500
The idea of a bloodthirty Jewish mob may be abhorrant to Jews, but it happened. Besides, except for Pilate there were few Romans involved. The "Roman"soldiers were probably Greek recruits, who had no love for Jews. The Roman armies that destroyed Jerusalem was mostly of the same background.
20
posted on
07/30/2003 8:40:24 PM PDT
by
RobbyS
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