Jewish lawmakers threaten walk-out over reference to Jesus

WorldNetDaily.com ^ | April 3, 2003 | Diana Lynne

[countrydummy]

What deny Christ? No way! If one denies Jesus, then He will deny them. I think the Jewish were being quite childish! The Jewish should understand and respect the fact that we Christians believe in Jesus. I respect them and their beliefs. The threat of walking out was very shameful!

[F16Fighter]

"They're [Muslim clerics] more sensitive than this preacher was."

Have you gotten PC-itis??

Oh I forgot -- you're religiously tolerant. Just as long as you're not offended by an Evangelist Protestant evoking the magic words ("In Jesus'name.')

Maybe you would rather hear an evocation to the effect of, "And let us pray to...'the Big Kahuna in the Sky.'"

[pepperdog]

Rippin, this is not directed to you, youve been the most reasonable of all the comments I've read most of this thread. Now I'll comment and leave. I was raised in an area where my religion was in the minority. I attended many functions where prayers were said that were different from my prayers. I learned early to just say my prayers to myself while others (the majority) said their prayers outloud. It seemed to work just fine. I never felt victimized and had a good life. I recommend keeping your mouth shut when you are in the minority religously speaking. And while your mouth is closed use the time to pray to your God, Higher Power, whatever, then try to get along with your fellow man like DECENT CIVILIZED PEOPLE SHOULD!

[AnalogReigns]

Clearly Jefferson wasn't a Christian, by any biblical standard. I don't know any responsble scholars who say otherwise.

One thing about the "Jeffersonain Bible" however. He edited it not as how he wanted the Bible to be, or even how he professed to believe, rather as a a tool for "evangelism" to the American Indians, because he thought the mirracles would distract from the essential moral teachings of Christ.

Christians have always claimed those same miracles, far from being a distraction, established and anchored the moral teachings of Christ, showing His right to make them....

[Dengar01]

What deny Christ? No way! If one denies Jesus, then He will deny them. I think the Jewish were being quite childish! The Jewish should understand and respect the fact that we Christians believe in Jesus. I respect them and their beliefs. The threat of walking out was very shameful!

I couldn't have said it better myself.

[hellinahandcart]

Is there not such a prayer that does not mention Jesus in the Christian religion?

Well, there's the Lord's Prayer, but in this case we are talking about a prayer of the minister's own composition (that's what ministers do).

I suppose he could have said "*I* ask in Jesus' Name", rather than closing with "In Jesus' Name", and then the complainers would have at least had to admit that he wasn't speaking for them, even if he was asking on their behalf.

I do suspect 'Pod is right about the political (and perhaps staged) nature of the objection to the traditional prayer, which has never occurred before this year. The senator who invited the minister to speak, and the three rabbis to be his other invited guests, seemed really thrown for a loop.

[saradippity]

I personally think the Our Father is the perfect prayer,it's simple,to the point,covers a lot of essentials and was recommended by Jesus. Additionally,it never mentions the name of Jesus and takes less than 30 seconds to pray.

I think too many "blessings" or invocations are taken as an oppurtunity to present one's own material from a furnished pulpit/podium to a captive audience.Nevertheless,I think that a country or nation that does not publlicly acknowledge a dependence,a gratefulness and a reliance on God's justice and mercy is destined for the dustbin.

So what do you think about just saying the Our Father,everyone will know in advance what's coming;those who don't like it can block it,remain in their own thoughts or substitute their own prayer.

[Delphinium]

I feel very close to the Jews for good reason. Bible believing Christians are the best friends the Jews have today. We believe that we serve the same God. I personally do not believe that the Muslims serve that same God. Just by the nature of their oppressive, and cruel religion. As Christians we must use the name of Jesus when we pray. We believe it is the only way to get to God. I know all about this thing called "politically correct" I believe those liberal, leftist churches like the world counsel of churches, etc. are not Christians any more. And as you can see lately, they are also enemies of the Jews. I would not be offended by a Jewish prayer, but could not pray without using the name of Jesus.

Here is something my pastor wrote. Hope it doesn't offend.

There are many things that we hold in common with the Jews. Some Jewish writers say that Christianity is a mirror reflection of Judaism. For example we use the same Old Testament as they do and hold to many of the same teachings. Both groups believe in one God.

Then we need to understand the roots of Christianity. Some Christians are not aware that Christianity had its origin with the Jews. At the beginning it was part of the Jewish religion. But because God did not intend the work of the cross to be limited to Jews, Christianity eventually became a religion of its own, and for all peoples. The prophets of the Old Testament said this would happen, and that God's people would be called by another name.

Jesus caused a division among the Jews that continues to this day. You might say that the Jewish religion was severed into two camps. Many thousands of the early Jews did believe in Jesus. This resulted in the Christian Jew. But many others did not.

The non-believing Jewish leadership tried to keep the peoples away from Jesus. Over time most Jewish people did not even know that Jesus and all the apostles were Jews. The 'new' Judaism that had been invented by the rabbis was totally different from ancient Judaism. Actually Judaism itself begin dividing into various groups. The three mains streams today are the Orthodox, Conservative, and the Reformed Jews.

To give you some background, what happened is that in 70 ad, Jerusalem was destroyed by the Roman armies, along with the temple. The fracture between the Christian Jew and the non-Christian Jew began to intensify. The non-Christian Jews no longer had a place to center their religion. The Christian Jew had no problem since they simply worshipped the true God through Jesus Christ. The Jewish leadership had to structure a new form of Judaism that would not be Christian.

This new form of Judaism eventually took on the name Rabbinical or Talmudic Judaism. But by now the Christian Jews had become more accustomed to worshipping God with peoples of other cultures. And so the name 'Christian' became the dominate name for all who believed in Jesus. The non-Christian Jew continued on a road that secluded themselves from other cultures.

For those Jews who fully rejected Jesus, the road of salvation was cut off. The Bible is very clear in that a person must believe in Jesus Christ in order to be saved. Jesus told certain Jewish leadership, "Unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins."(John 8:24) Jesus died for the sins of the world. If any person rejects His great sacrifice, they have no other means of salvation. Even the Old Testament prophets taught this.

The good news today is that many Jews are turning to Jesus in great number. According to reports, more Jews have turned to Jesus in the last 19 years than in the last 1900 years. Other reports tell us of a great move in Israel to reclaim Jesus to their heritage.

[TopQuark]

Jewish organizations that oversee such writings don't want them widely read,

What a great way to finish the day! Thanks for making me laugh so hard! Oh, this is really funny.

This is a new Jewish conspiracy --- to hide the Talmud! Well you are not exacly right: when we get together to pray on Fridays, we first go to a special room that exists in every sinagogue and discuss our progress on subjugating the world; then we kill a Christian teenager to make matzos of his blood; it only after that we proceed to hide the Talmud.

If only all bigots were so pathetically obvious as you are...

[TopQuark]

I am not an authority on religion, but I think you are right.

[Delphinium]

forgot to add you to my last post.

[Lev]

as this belief in God was set right when we were founded.

Could you explain how a belief can be 'set'? An individual can have beliefs, but a belief can't be 'set' for others, if that's what you mean.

[TopQuark]

Joe, subtraction is not the only operation in algebra. Grow up.

[AnalogReigns]

""If Jews, Moslems or people of other religions don't like that: GET OVER IT. IT'S CALLED TOLLERANCE!""

"I love it! If you don't like potatoes, you are still going to eat nothing but potatoes for the rest of the year --- get over it!

What do you mean, why? 'Cause I said so! Don't you know, this is a democracy, damn it! Seargant, take out this man and shoot him: we don't want him to spoil this democracy of ours.

HELP!"


You gave an incomplete quote of me, and your "logic" is just not there.

Religious tollerance is not watering down your religious expression so as not to offend anyone...its mainly, choosing not to be offended by the closely held religious beliefs of others--even if they are publically expressed.

A Christian who reflects and follows the teachings of Jesus IS OFFENDED by prayers that do not obey those teachings... Does that mean they walk out when the Rabbi or Imam gets up to pray? NO, we grin and bear it, respectfully bow our heads, and silently pray for the man, that he may come to a better understanding of truth.

It's a rightful request for tollerance to expect the same respect from them, when a Christian gets up and prays.

Nobody's asking anyone to eat potatos for a year...or is about shooting anyone.

You sound like a typical liberal putting words into peoples mouths when you can't form a solid argument in response to them.

[Delphinium]

As a Christian I am deeply offended by neutral, ecumenical, namby-pamby prayers--they disobey the commands of Jesus, and they don't reflect reality...

AMEN.

[djf]

You asked a question and I replied. Jewish theory is an eye for an eye. Christian theory is turn the other cheek. You have no idea who I am or what my opinions are, everything I posted here is basically factual information. Grow up. Learn it. Live with it.

[Deb]

Your Jefferson opinion is by far the dumbest I've ever seen. I have a copy of the Jefferson Bible and nowhere in it is there anything but Jefferson's hand-written notes in the margins and under-linings of profound thought.

"Distract the indians"...I'd love to see your source for that one. Where do you anti-Christian, re-writers of history come up with this crap, on the toilet?

Read any of Jefferson's letters to Adams and try to pretend he wasn't a Christian.

[Slings and Arrows]

Two points:

1. The lawmakers who threatened a walkout need to get a sense of proportion. They remind me of the anti-circumcision crowd: Making a mountain out of a mohel. *rimshot*

2. This has nothing to do with the issue at hand, but it's a pet peeve of mine: Why do people insist on using the redundant phrase "Jewish rabbis?" It is necessary to identify denomination when speaking of priests and ministers, because multiple denominations have both (e.g., Catholic vs. Episcopalian priests, Presbyterian vs. Lutheran ministers), but only one religion has rabbis, and most people know which one it is.

P.S. Don't get me started on "hot water heater."

[Illbay]

Bible believing Christians are the best friends the Jews have today.

Few Jews will agree with you, no matter what YOU think.