Posted on 02/21/2003 1:33:16 PM PST by FreeTally
Here is a first hand account that is from www.metal-sludge.com
This email was just sent into us by Sludgeaholic George Dionne. It's a chilling account of what he experienced at the Great White show last night.
My name is George Dionne. I was at the Great White show on February 20th at The Station in Rhode Island. I would like to share with you my personal account of what can only be described as a tragedy. I warn you that my descriptions may be upsetting, but it affected me immensely. I was standing approximately 5 rows back from the front of the stage. If you've seen the video footage, I was one step behind the camera man as the tape begins. The band took the stage around 11PM. A small fireworks display ignited. It was a fan-like display. It lasted about 10-15 seconds. When it died down I could see that the back wall had started to catch fire. The walls that surround the stage area were covered with a foam, egg-crate, sound-proofing material. At the site of the first flame I knew something was wrong.
I made my way towards the only exit I knew of, the front door. The exit was approximately 500-700 ft. away from my position. I could hear people laughing and cheering at the flames, I assumed they thought it was part of the show. I was yelling at people to get out the door as I made my way out of the club. I looked over my shoulder and saw that the flames had shot up the sides of the walls and was now engulfing the ceiling. It was spreading FAST! At first the crowd was calm, but as the flames spread, I found the space around me shrinking. People were now panicking and rushing for the front door. The club was filling up with toxic smoke as I cut a sharp left to get out the door. I could not see anything at this point. I began choking on the smoke. I could not see the exit, but I knew it was in front of me. The flood of people finally pushed me through the door. I made my way to the parking lot.
I looked back and saw the stage section of the club engulfed with flames. The other half of the club was filled with black smoke. I could hear people screaming and windows breaking. I saw people breaking the windows and diving out. I returned to the building to help get the people out. When I returned to the front door, I could not believe what I was looking at. There were 35 or so people stuck in the door way. They were stacked in rows on top of each other, at least 7 rows high. Black smoke was pouring out above them. You could see that there were people behind them as well. A small group of people were pulling at the people in the pile to try and move them. I jumped up on the ramp and grabbed an arm. I pulled and pulled with all my strength just to try and move them. There were others helping me, but we could not move anyone. The smoke was getting really think and starting to choke me. I continued to pull. The smoke was just too much for me, I had to let go of the arm. It was the toughest decision I had to make and I am still trying to cope with it. I stepped away from the building as I watched the smoke start to cover my view. It was at this point I dropped to my knees and prayed. I not as religious as I could be, but I needed to do it. I thanked my God for saving me. I prayed for the people still trapped inside. As I got up to leave, I saw the most horrifying image.
The flames had made there way to the door way. The people on the top of the pile were on fire. There was nothing anyone could do for them. I watched as the fire grew around these poor, helpless people. I broke down right there. I could see them suffering and there was nothing I could do. I left the club as the Fire Department arrived. I did not want to get in their way. I drove down the street, but had to pull over, because I was so distraught. I called my wife and told her how much I loved her. I called everyone that I love and told them that I loved them. I spent the whole night thinking about what had happened. I did not sleep. Everytime I thought about it, I cried. I shook all night. I still shake a little as I type this. It upsets me everytime I repeat my story. I regret so much that I could not help more. However, I am so glad to be alive.
I know it people say it all the time, but I ask that you remind your loved ones how much you love them. You really don't know if it will be the last time you see them. I feel blessed that I have a loving family and dear friends. I do not blame Great White or The Station for what happened, it was just a tragic accident. I can only image the grief and suffering that these people are going through. My prayers are with the injured. My prayers are with the families of those who did not make it. I am comforted in knowing that the deceased are in a better place.
George Dionne
A couple of years ago, when my niece was a Zeta at Carolina, she called me up to tell me they were going to a party at the Pika house in Chapel Hill.
Before I could stop myself I yelled, "Don't you DARE go in that basement."
It was a firehole when I was there.
In a fire like this one, there was enough air inside the club to burn enough fuel to heat the air up to the point of flashover (spontaneous ignition of everything inside). Ventilation of a fire helps prevent flashover by allowing the hot air and smoke to escape. That is why firefighters often poke holes in the roofs of burning buildings.
With 250+ people and just one exit, for all practical purposes, it would only take one or two people to stop thinking before a chain reactions of sorts is started and then you have what happened here and in Chicago.
The problem is simply because it's a large crowd of uncoordinated humans. There is no way to create a "mass intelligence" between so many people, especially during a crisis.
All I was saying is that when two airliners struck the towers, there was a very strong element of "mass intelligence" among tens of thousands of people who had no idea what was coming next or if they were going to survive.
That said, I'm wondering how people got "bottled up" in the doorway -- how they couldn't just get out when they were right there. I just had to turn away every time they showed that on TV, so maybe I'm missing something.
Somehow I think the lawyers will disagree with him.
And I think that little impromptu interview the lead singer of "Great White" gave saying he "got permission" and "It wasn't our fault." Will be used against him in court.
What I found most puzzling was the part where he said that the club gave permission, but shouldn't have done so.
Like the band isn't sentient enough to realize that low ceilings in a small room aren't conducive to sparklers and can only be persuaded to not use them if a club owner tells them not to do it?
Possibly so.
What we do have is this: We know for a fact neitehr the club nor the band applied for and received a permit to have pyro. Someone is screwed there. We also have a few other clubs saying "Hey, they used pyro here and we didn't know about it". That is the interesting part. Notcie from the videos, the pyro they used isn't major at all. Very minor stuff that (obviously) presents no problem in most any typical club that has appropriate fire resistant materials by the stage. I would not doubt if they did exactly what the singer said, asked permission, but never sought permits in these other clubs. Now, pyro was used in these clubs, and it was probably against city regulations to do so without a permit. Its altogether possible that these clubs are covering their butts by saying "we didn't know they were going to use pyro".
Also odd to me is that the story of the owner of the "Stone Pony" seems to have changed. First, he said they used them without permission. Today, I here him saying he stopped the show. That seems unlikely to me, because the pyro was over in less than ten seconds, and is not used again.
Fox also reported this morning that another club has come forward and said GW asked permission to use pyro and were denied - and they didn't use them. Kind of adds a little crdibility to the story of the singer. Many clubs may simply have been ignoring the fire code and allowing pyro without a permit, and now fear they will get in trouble in light of this tragedy.
It will be interesting to see how this turns out in court.
I saw this table, posted below in our local paper and it looks like about 50/50 if they asked or didn't for permission for pyro. Wonder if they started getting told no to pyro from club owners too often that they decided it was better to ask forgiveness than permission.
They may have felt that doing the concert w/o pyro ruined the "look" they were trying to create.
Sampling of shows from tour
JAN. 23, GLENDALE HEIGHTS, ILL.: Great White manager mentioned pyrotechnics. Shark City manager said club did not allow them, and effects were not used.
JAN. 25, HEWITT, MINN.: Band used "flashpots" at the Checkers Bar. Club booker Brian Hendershot said club was informed in advance.
JAN. 27, SIOUX CITY, IOWA: Band used pyrotechnics. Dan Lewis, owner of Lewis Bowl & Sports Bar, could not recall whether band sought permission.
JAN. 30, MILWAUKEE: Band apparently used pyrotechnics, though the Rave club did not have a permit for the effects, said Todd Weiler, spokesman for the Milwaukee Department of Neighborhood Services.
FEB. 3, EVANSVILLE, IND.: Band complied with request not to use pyrotechnics at Oxygen, owner said.
FEB. 7, PINELLAS PARK, FLA.: Band used pyrotechnics without notification at the Pinellas Park Expo Center, said Tim Bryant, president of Past to Present Productions.
FEB. 8, BOYNTON BEACH, FLA.: Band complied with request not to use pyrotechnics at Ovation, owner said.
FEB. 10, ATLANTA: Band did not use pyrotechnics at The Riviera Club, club production manager said.
FEB. 11, WINSTON-SALEM, NC: Officials at Ziggy's Tavern told fire marshal band did not use pyrotechnics.
FEB. 13, ALLENTOWN, PA.: Band used pyrotechnics at the Crocodile Rock Cafe without notice, owner Joe Clark said.
FEB. 14, ASBURY PARK, N.J.: Band used pyrotechnics at the Stone Pony without telling club officials, owner Domenic Santana said.
FEB. 18, BANGOR, MAINE: Authorities investigating reports pyrotechnics used without a permit.
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