Wake Up America: Another Liberal Agenda Exposed

[Empireofhawks]

A few weeks ago my son got into trouble at school, nothing serious, but the school wanted him to go through a process of what is called restorative justice. I agreed after I learned that Florida Governor Jeb Bush and several other leaders in the GOP support this idea. We were referred to a group called the Council on Reconciliation and Restorative and Transformative Justice (CORRTJ). It was not until after the dust had settled that we discovered what we had gotten ourselves into.

[TLBSHOW]

The story is interesting but the link to Jeb Bush is a ratty rat smear that is not proven and did you see how he paints it Jeb and the GOP? If he is correct then why as he not linked to that fact? HMMMMMMMMMMMM

I have been just fine! Glad you are too! :>) How is that project coming along?

[MarkL]

Most of the people working on this effort are Quakers and refuse to affirm their loyalty toward President Bush. What more do we need to know?

Historically, parcticing Quakers have always been true pacifists, and have never given political alegance to any president or political parts.

I've never had problems with "true, religious" pacifists. I once had the chance to get to know a CO who refused to pick up a gun for battle, but when he was drafted, he didn't run, just announced his opposition to participating in battle, and volunteered for the medical services. He became a medic, and was exposed to enemy fire on more than one occasion. He was one of the bravest men I ever met.

Mark

[philman_36]

There is no such thing as a victimless crime. Every crime has at least one victim - the offender.
Now I understand!

[MarkL]

The Council on Reconciliation and Restorative and Transformative Justice:

Principles of Restorative Justice

1. Law and justice are not synonymous terms.

I don't think that most of us would disagree with this one. There have been (and currently are) many unjust laws on the books. Of course, I suppose it depends on "whose ox is being gored."

2. Restorative justice requires a balanced focus on the needs of offenders, victims and community.

Whoa there Nellie! The order should be 1) Victims and 2) Community. The focus on the offender should be in making sure that the offender doesn't do it again!

3. Ownership of the restorative process must belong to the community.

I have to agree with this to some extent: However, the victim should be "restored" as well. And the victim should be querried on how the acts of the offender affected his or her life, or the lives of the victim's survivors.

4.There is no such thing as a victimless crime. Every crime has at least one victim - the offender.

I strongly disagree here in the vast majority of cases, but I do agree in some specific cases. First, the disagreements. Classifing "offenders" as victims is demeaning to the REAL victims. What you've got here is moral relativism, and an attempt to keep from assessing blame, i.e. that a person is responsible for their actions! It's sort of like saying that the lady who was just convicted of murdering her husband (by running him over multiple times) was a victim of her husband. SHE WAS NOT A VICTIM!!!!! Her husband may have really pissed her off by having an affair, but she made the decision to run him over, and then turn the car around and do it again! Or like saying the Menendez brothers are victims of child abuse (never proven), and now they're really victims, since they're orphans!

On the other hand, there two classes of "victimless crime," where the offender can be a victim. In illegal possession and use of drugs, if the offender has no dependants, and is putting nobody in direct peril (or indirect, for that matter), when he or she is busted, then they can become a victim of the WOD. In the second case, when it comes to prostitution, many of the ladies are very much victims of both their johns, as well as the legal system. I can't think of other cases where I agree with this item...

4. Offenders, victims and community members must reach consensus on what needs to be done to heal the harm of crime.

WRONG!!!! The offender should NOT be consulted on their punishment! That's up to the community (i.e. the courts) with input from the victims!

5. Offender and victim participation in the restorative process must be voluntary.

Yeah, right... "Excuse me, convicted murderer, but would you mind spending the next 50 years in prison?" I remember when I got into trouble for some acts of "juvinile delinquency." I committed some property crimes, and nobody asked me what I thought that felt I should do. I was punnished severely, in addition to paying restitution for the damage I caused. That's how it should have been. I should have known better than to do what I did, but I guess there was a "lapse of judgement." Well, that punnishment made sure that there were never any other lapses.

6. The restorative process must be culturally sensitive.

Just what the hell does that mean? Does this mean that certain groups should have different punnishments? What sort of nonsense is this?

7. Opportunities for healing offenders, victims and community must occur at four levels: physical, psychological, emotional and spiritual.

Yeah, right... See the comment for #6!

8. Success is full reintegration into the community for offenders and victims upon completion of the restorative contract.

More nonsense... What the hell does this mean? At what point is the victim no longer a part of the community? Of course, in a murder case, I guess I can support that... "When the victim is no longer dead, we'll let you (the offender) out of jail." More "new age" nonsense!

9. Offenders and victims work together to find that of G-d in each other, for the benefit of the common good of the community.

Wait a minute, they used the "G" word! They can't do that, not in a governmental sense! [/Sarcasm]. Of course, I suppose that if they use the word "G-d" in the "traditional, Judeo-Christian sense, there would be quite an outcry, but if they use it in a new age, touchy-feely sense, it would be OK. As long as the "G-d" they're refering to doesn't have any hard and fast rules.

Grrrrrr... This stuff really pisses me off!

Mark

[Empireofhawks]

Some of us have a life and don't spend the day parked waiting to reply. I gave the information you need, if you are smart enough to follow a couple of links, but since you are not check out ZFlorida Proclamation I'm afraid this group needs to get a clue as far as intentions of new posters. Just of this thread it will be a while before I place much trust in some.

[Empireofhawks]

I was ticked enough to put the wrong URL
www.fcrjquaker.org/Floridaproclamation.html

[TLBSHOW]

I did a google and found nothing that linked Jeb, thanks for linking it.

[deport]

FLORIDA RESTORATIVE JUSTICE PROCLAMATION

WHEREAS, crime is one of the most serious problems facing our state and nation; and

WHEREAS, crime affects not only individuals but also entire communities. Crime and fear destroy our trust in others and in our institutions, threatening the community's health and prosperity; and

WHEREAS, The Restorative Justice Ministry Network of North America is looking beyond our current criminal justice system and looking to the Bible for concepts and solutions; and

WHEREAS, The Restorative Justice Ministry Network is a Christ-centered, interdenominational, criminal justice ministry that strives to reach criminal offenders, victims and criminal justice professionals. Their mission is "networking with individuals and organizations to collaborate in creating and implementing Biblical solutions to the Criminal Justice mission field";and

WHEREAS, The Restorative Justice Ministry Network will acknowledge April 14-21, 2002, as Restorative Justice Week;

NOW, THEREFORE, I, Jeb Bush, Governor of the State of Florida, do hereby extend greetings and best wishes to all observing Restorative Justice Week, April 14-21, 2002.

IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I
have hereunto set my hand
and caused the Great Seal of
the state of Florida to be affixed
at Tallahassee, the Capital, this
4th day of March in the year
of our Lord two thousand two.   

[summer]

LOL...well, I guess I am an idiot, since I did not notice anything in your post connecting your story to Gov. Bush.

[deport]

Ratty Rats all over the place.... Yep you've taught them well.... to show up an disperse their drivel

Now how does the Senate stay in session without a quorum? Any Ideas? Maybe some other Ratty Rat would know.... reckon?

[summer]

Re your post #28 and this initial post by EmpireHawkwhatever. I don't think these two organizations are one in the same at all. Furthermore, Gov Bush is endorsing an organization that I doubt is found in any public school in FL, since it is "Bible" centered.

[TLBSHOW]

This group that works with kids in schools throughout the US (especially Idaho, Colorado, California, Florida, Texas and Maine) has a radical, and I do mean radical anti-war, anti-everything agenda.


I guess Jeb has some explaining to do. First I will read all I can on this group. If this poster is correct then what the heck is Jeb and Florida doing involved with this bunch?

[summer]

Also, please post photos of Gov Bush from this CURRENT century! :)


GOV JEB BUSH [photo is from THIS century!]

[TLBSHOW]

I googled and had come up with nothing. I still think its suspect but I will do more looking. What is your thoughts?

[summer]

See my post #31 - I seriously doubt these two organizations are one and the same. One is Bible-centered, and that is the one Gov Bush endorsed, and as such, it is not an organization found in public schools in FL> Maybe this poster chooses to educate his kid in a private school that uses a wacko system of punishment, and if so, that is his choice and his problem. Here is a solution: Take your kid out of that private school and enroll your kid elsewhere.

[TLBSHOW]

Whatever deport!

[deport]

51 ...... Any ideas how to get to fifty one? Surely you know.

[Empireofhawks]

Okay, I just read Axis of Love I have never seen liberals toss the G*d word around like this group does. I thought liberals got mad when conservatives try and talk about G*d. Who would have ever thought of liberals talking about G*d , what's next? Even if it is a "New Age God". Liberals supporting the Second Amendment? Sorry, I cannot take any more of this. I've written Governor Bush and I will do my part to spread the word around the Hillsborough District. Just keep the peaceniks out our schools, please!

[TLBSHOW]

I know I am checking but as I said my google came up with nothing that linked Jeb.

[TLBSHOW]

try and stay on subject here. I know its hard for you and all!