FOAM HAS PLAGUED NASA FOR 5 YEARS

Mercury News ^

[fooman]

NASA has asked that tests involving freon free foam be witheld. What are they hiding?

Article shows a NASA engineer noting the difficulties in creating the same characteristics.

[Dave S]

Advance knowledge of the problems with the foam means CIVIL LIABILITY, BIG BUCKS.

Ever hear of sovereign immunity?

[fooman]

I had heard that the event happened 80 secs into flight at somewhere between mach 2 and 4.

I wish someone would ask Ron tomorrow whether or not freon free foam was used.

[chaosagent]

This is not the wing. It is the inside of one of the cargo bay doors. That tophat thing is part of the latch system.

If you see the full video this is from, those 'cracks' are actually wire harnesses on the inside of the door.

This shot is looking slightly forward.

It is NOT the wing.

[KC_for_Freedom]

Please cut them some slack -- Accident Investigations do not happen over night!

Your right PKmom, but if it turns out that the crazy junk science of ozone regulations has resulted in a shuttle disaster, I want the whole world to know.

As a former LM employee I have watched as process after process was changed from the "best" to the "next best" approach to comply with those regulations. You would think if shuttle crew's lives were on the line they could get an exemption for the fuel tank foam.

[drjoe]

"the hit was on the leading edge of the wing= 90 degree hit X mach 4 X 30 lbs."

This is so tiresome. The tank with insulation was going at Mach 4. The shuttle was going at Mach 4. The insulation breaks off and is whipped backwards by the slip-stream. It strikes the shuttle wing but NOT at a velocity of mach 4 relative to the wing. Its actual velocity could possibly be determined by knowing the frames per second of the film and the actual dimensions and geometry of the structures. Anyone here done that? No? Gee, that's what I thought.

[fooman]

I think I regret starting this thread. I wanted to talk about the new info in the Mercury article, but there are too many flames here.

Feel free to lock this sucker down, it wont hurt my feelings.

[aristeides]

Ever hear of sovereign immunity?

There are circumstances under which it can be lifted, or waived. The federal government and Thiakol (sp?) ended up settling with the families of the Challenger victims for a million bucks for each family.

[Quilla]

See your post #44 on this thread.

[fooman]

You have a point here, but the foam would decel fairly quickly.

Speed doesn't kill, but sudden changes in speed might.

[Howlin]

I am not saying that the foam angle is being witheld.

That is EXACTLY what you said in your title, which, btw, is bogus.

[CWOJackson]

Today we pay tribute to seven brave people. These seven people were combat pilots, aeronautical engineers, scientists…astronauts. Many of them had been with the space program for years, for others this was the culmination of their dreams.

Within hours of this terrible disaster there were some on FR claiming that the disaster was the result of NASA’s incompetence, that the disaster was avoidable and that the cover up had already began. They have offered up memo’s, doctored photos and wild rumor as evidence.

In order to be true than we must also assume that the seven astronauts who died were fools or somehow duplicitous in their own deaths. Are we expected to believe that the knowledge of a few rumor mongers on the internet is greater then that of those who flew on Challenger?

Are we to believe that these seven astronauts were not aware of the foam problems on the shuttle program or the effects of budget cuts on the program? Are we to believe that they were foolish enough to fly a platform into space that was doomed from the beginning as some on FR claim?

If we accept their speculation then we must also assume that their fellow astronauts, walking the woodlands of east Texas looking for their remains, will not seek to discover the real cause of their deaths, but will work to cover up for NASA. Do you really believe this?

Is this what we’ve come to on FR? This doesn’t just smear NASA, it smears the seven brave people we honor today.

[Dave S]

FReepers are allergic to finding out what really happened, and are desperate to use all sorts of excuses and tactics to shut down discussion.

You pompous blowhards. No discussion here is kind to determine what really happened. If the free world has to depend on you, TLBSLOW, and Fred Mertz to come up with answers, we might as well give up on space travel and go back to the Middle Ages and see if we cant use a little alchemy to create gold out of iron.

[lonestar]

Agree. I remember Sunday some NASA spokesman announced that remains of all 7 astronauts had been found. Obviously not true because they had not had sufficient time to identify any remains.

[isthisnickcool]

Posted on Tue, Feb. 04, 2003

FOAM HAS PLAGUED NASA FOR 5 YEARS
By Curtis Morgan, Manny Garcia and Ronnie Greene
Knight Ridder


I read the thing. I found nothing that says that NASA is withholding test results. Since you posted this with a title that is not accurate maybe you can point out where the article says "NASA withholding results". I don't see it.

[chaosagent]

Actually, if you see the video this came from, it is from the Shuttle.

It looks to be from one of the arm cameras and is kind of looking back forward and down at the edge of the cargo bay door. The camera looks to located right above the crew compartment bulkhead looking into the cargo bay.

As it pans about 180 degrees to the left you see the cargo bay, the tail, the OMS pods, and the tip of the wing.

Unfortunately I don't have the link to the video here at work.

[Howlin]

Here is the VIDEO that picture Todd is trying to pass off as shuttle damage came from.

Lest anybody think he's NOT foisting a fraud on this forum.

http://home.earthlink.net/~sigma90/israelrebut.mpg

[Howlin]

See 96.

[deport]

TLBSHOW, why do you continue to post a picture that has been discounted as not being what it proports to be? What is your agenda in promoting outright disinformation? Look at the following....

FYI...... at least try for the truth

---

now to compare it to the one that the Israeli paper said was the Columbia wing with damage.....

• Did NASA know there was a problem? PIC and Excerpts from an Israeli Article

• Debunking the Israeli tabloid "shuttle wing" photo

[TLBSHOW]

Designer: 1 bad tile
could cause disaster
NASA calls liftoff glitch leading theory in investigation

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=30838

[KC_for_Freedom]

You are correct that the angle is important. That is why NASA used three different shearing angles in their computer simulation runs. These runs also used three different masses for the impacting foam. This was reported by Ron. They believe they enveloped the actual case, but if the foam was denser due to ice build up, maybe they did not look at the worst case. also, the fact that this article points out that the foam used from flight 87 to the present is denser leaves open the question of how valid this simulation is with today's concern. (They used the depth of actual gashes to validate their program, but, did they re validate after the foam was changed?)