NASA: Shuttle Temperature Rose Suddenly

Yahoo News ^ | 2/2/03 | Paul Recer - AP

[sneakypete]

That's why 'casual observers' are just that. They don't know all the facts.

I can tell you one fact I DO know. When the military plans a operation,a redunancy of equipment and personell ARE a part of all their planning. This is called contingency planning. They hold equipment and personell in reserve in case they are needed. There is no reason NASA couldn't do the same as a matter of course,and keep another shuttle held in reserve and ready to go within a day (at the MOST) if needed. There is no reason to not have EVA suits and tethers aboard each flight in case the crew needs to examine a part of the shuttle before the decision is made to call in backup,or try to land it. Unlike a lot of the other stuff NASA is involved in,this AIN'T rocket science. It's just basic,fundamental,good planning.

[NormsRevenge]

I just post 'em .. and move on ;-)

Check out The Space Shuttle Orbiter and Ceramic Tiles - Some History and Information ... I got to get back to digging.

[NormsRevenge]

It's hard to ignore the ignoramuses, particularly as they are persistent. I have been taking note of certain screen names, and taken to read the name at the bottom of a post before I bother to read the post.

How'm I doin? 8-|

[_Jim]

Bump for a potentially important post.

This *might* have only minor implications: longevity and reducing the repairs that need to be made.

Sort of along the lines of changing from Polyester cord tires to Steel belted radials instade ...

No real change in safety - just a longer usable life for one style/type of tile over the other ...

[One Sided Media]

This is the spouse of "one sided media" and I would like to relay the information I contacted NASA about the cause of the accident.

In the news conference held a couple of hours ago,part of the discussion was about the "roll control" and the inertial control system that manages yaw, pitch and roll of the spacecraft. We know in the last couple of minutes prior to the telemetry failing that the ship was rolling to its left, evidenced by the increase in temperature along the left wing and left side of the fuselage. Within a few moments of the telemetry failure, and it may have been what ultimately caused the communication's failure, I believe the control failed. As the ship rolled its left wing downward, the tiles on top of the wing and fuselage took the brunt of the friction and resulting heat. Because these tiles were not designed to handle this type of temperature, the friction overheated the fuselage, causing the explosion that we have seen on the video through out the day.

The ultimate question is why did the ship begin to roll?

[_Jim]

When the military plans a operation,a redunancy of equipment and personell ARE a part of all their planning.

BIG DIFF when you have the manpower and budget to do this ... NASA doesn't ...

[mvpel]

Back when I was a space program maven in 1980 or so, when I was 10 years old, I remember reading about some sort of ablative material that could be applied to the location of a missing tile in order to make re-entry survivable. Since I read it some twenty years ago, I have no idea where I read it or what the details of the material or its application were. Does anyone else remember this?

[Rebelbase]

"They've already admitted they had no way to view the underside of the shuttle to inspect for damage"

Has anyone heard any discussion of if would have been possible during the 16 days in orbit to have had the shuttle vist the space station and have had the 3 occupants there take a look at the underside?

[_Jim]

The ultimate question is why did the ship begin to roll?

We're all waiting for a definitive answer on that one ... "increased drag" on the left side is cause - but *why* is the $64,000 question ...

[_Jim]

had the shuttle vist the space station

They ran short on money for gas ... seriously - you *plan* for your orbit/orbital inclination and final orbit height and that wasn't the plan for STS-107 ...

[Cboldt]

Your handle doesn't register on my meter (yet!!)

Thank you for your service.

Seriously, many of the ideas floated on these threads have been asked and answered about two dozen times already. I can understand the need for some repetition, but geez, Louise!!

[Merdoug]

Reading these posts about tiles, I thought of a repair that maybe hasn't been considered. Instead of trying to attach a tile to a possible damaged section, why not have like a big "belt" with tile sections that bend. The whole belt, maybe three feet wide, could be floated out the cargo door and moved (maybe with a remote controlled rocket thingy) around the outside of the shuttle and then the belt secured to the cargo area on either side. This would give at least something of a "patch" over the damaged area.

[chaosagent]

They did not have enough delte-vee to get anywhere near the ISS. The orbits were too different.

[One Sided Media]

Given the amount of surface beneath the left hand wing, it would take more then just a few tiles being lost to create the amount of drag needed to unbalance the descent. I think the tiles will turn out to be a dead end. More likely something in the internal control system.

[ladyinred]

The live sightings by freepers in California did indicate that there may have been a problem while the shuttle was passing over here.

[_Jim]

More likely something in the internal control system.

BUT for the recorded increase of temps and subsequent loss of temp sensors - I would agree with you ...

[StriperSniper]

Know a good glue that works in a vaccuum at either +500 or -250 deg F?

Barnacle glue?;-)

[VMI70]

Fascinating reply--thanks

I had some questions:
"As for a quick spacewalk, well the suits weigh an awful lot, and you need two. So you cut your payload dramatically carrying the suits (and suit consumables) you need for that quick look-see. "

How much do the suits weigh? Assume they weigh 500# each. Is the paylosd calculated so closely that the additional 1000# would be too far outside the max takeoff weight?


"But lets say you waste the weight on the EVA equipment. You know those tiles are about as hard as styrofoam. Brittle, too. An astronaut swanning around near them has a good chance to break them."

That's a real revelation. I always thought that they were like refractory brick. That is why I had such a hard time seeing how a piece of insulation could damage the tiles. So, if it is like styrofoam, the individual shaping would not be a problem as a custom cut from an oversize square blank should be fairly simple. Then the attachment problems would have to be addressed.
I have often thought that a mastic "filler" could be developed that would give enough protection to get through reentry.
Why would it be necessary to send a whole space shuttle up for repair or rescue? We send up heavy 3 stage rockets all the time to put satellites into orbit. It could carry provisions, repair materials, or even a small lifting body. It would seem to me that having something like that on standby would be money well spent.

The underlying premise of your reply addressing the recognized danger of space flight, and the impossibility of creating a foolproof system was enlightening, well reasoned, and well written.

[tophat9000]

http://www.floridatoday.com/columbia/debrisvideo.htm

[Doohickey]

He didn't duck the question. Aside from the fact that the shuttle orbits the earth upside down, I don't know of a telescope of sufficient power that can track from horizon to horizon in 90-120 seconds.