Commuter Plane Crash @ Charlotte NC Airport (BREAKING)

www.msnbc.com ^ | 8 Jan 03 | MSNBC

[TankerKC]

Breaking news. Charlotte to Greenville flight--19 on board. Crashed on takeoff into a US Airways hangar.

More to follow...

[MindBender26]

I base out of Sanford.

Actually, I don't worry so much about overgross as I do W&B. Commercial operators in Alaska are authorized an automatic gorss wt increase of 10%. Gross, (especially in a SE A/C) deals primarily with rate of climb (not a problem here!) and turbulent air penetration speeds.

But out of balance will kill you! I'm off to DC. Be well!

[IFly4Him]

We have crew base for Piedmont Airlines (another USAir Express carrier)here in Charlottesville, VA. Your report is confirmed by one of the pilots who was on the ramp this morning watching the whole thing unfold.

The 1900 took off on 18R at the kind of climb angle you'd see at an airshow. It gained 400 ft before stalling and rolling left and crashing. This could point to a trim issue. Perhaps the crew took off with full nose up pitch trim, who knows. Load shift is unlikely since this plane was not configured for cargo. The 1900 is essentially a large King Air. I don't recall them having a pitch trim warning system, but they do have movable stabilators. Maybe a jackscrew issue?

Anyhow, I don't think it'll be long before we know...

[Pure Country]

Just heard that a Bob Jones University student was on board the plane. She was a missionary daughter on her way back to school. Some of our good friends' granddaughter was supposed to be on that flight back to school from Spain. She also attends BJU and changed her flight because of the high cost and someone had offered to give her a ride for the last jaunt. The girls were very good friends. Please pray for both families as this is a very hard time for them. Names have not been given out yet, so I won't post her name here either.

[agincourt1415]

I am not a King Air Pilot, and a witness said that one of the engine props was not turning (now if he was a pilot I just might believe him)but you know how it is with a untrained observer.

Anyway, I had always thought that a Turbo Engine Fail, is quick response, do the dead foot, dead engine ID (prop condition lever to neutral thrust or feather), and retard the correct throttle - if that. But above all else fly the airplane first, hold Blue Line, and Rudder.

Anyway, I remember back to my first hour of multi -Engine instruction, I was already a CFI, and the other instructor told me that he would fail an engine on the takeoff run, he instructioned me just to retard both throttles and get on the brakes.

I knew it was gona happen and, sure enough, he pulled one mixture control (with the Card Board hiding his movements on the quadrant) and I was all over that runway LOL, he looked at me with a grin after we got stopped and said - SEE I told you what was going to happen, and guess what, this is exactly what can happen in real life, when you have no idea what's coming.

So that's just the way it is in flying.

[dalereed]

"But out of balance will kill you!"

A fat ass 260# nurse that switched seats with a 90# doctor put me 10" aft CG and cost me my Saratoga, tell me about it
!!

[agincourt1415]

That's awful, what they switched and it messed up a landing or takeoff?

[Denver Ditdat]

sc-rms, Member since 26 December 2002

I hope you're enjoying that new computer you got for Christmas, though I'm afraid you're not off to an auspicious start here at FR. HLL is a long time, well-respected poster, and definitely does not fit the "intolerant commie pig PC police" category.

New members are always welcome at Free Republic, but a little circumpection goes a long way during the first few weeks. Spend a little time browsing the threads, get the feel of the place, and learn a few of the more common screen names and associated reputations built up through long posting before you decide to trash someone.

[dalereed]

"messed up a landing or takeoff?"

They switched when I went through a squall line about 200 miles below Guymas and we were getting bounced around pretty good and when I set down at a short dirt strip it was adobe and wet underneath and like grease. I got on it and got out but couldn't clear high tension lines on 3 sides of me so I was going to go under them and with her big fat ass in the tail it just sunk out at full power. I slamed into a 2' berm and bounced through the mesquite and totaled it. Everyone got out alive is about the only good thing.

[leadpenny]

Terrorism still not ruled out.

This almost vertical climb right after TO is puzzling and it is what I believe they are keying in on. A loss of an engine after lift off would not normally lead to a pitch up. As I remember the earlier versions of the 1900 (A and C), it is aft CG critical. This is sounding more and more like either improper baggage/cargo loading or shifting of the b/c after TO. Don't know about the D model but with the A and C, if the airplane was loaded in an out of CG (aft), you could tell when you started to taxi.

[agincourt1415]

But a 260# - that person is only gona be in the right FRONT SEAT, next to me, I would not put a 260# in a Club Seat Not a Chance, cause they will move, at the worst possible time -but then I am not perfect and - until we do something dumb - and I have done plenty of stuff - in airplanes worse - but got away with it - but I am getting into the OLD PILOT that wants to die in bed of old age mode now. I'm sick over your saratoga.

[leadpenny]

A/C crashed before 9/11 too.

Really?

[dalereed]

BTW,I'm glad it was a 300 hp Saratoga and not a 260!

I never would have made it off the end of the strip and we would have all been dead in the bottom of a 20' deep wash full of boulders! As it was the gear clipped the mesquite at the end that was only about 8' high.

It would fly as long as you could slam the doors and were in balance. I flew 1200# of scallops with full fuel from Mexico to LAX twice a week for a year without any problem even when the temperature at takeoff was 110 degrees.

[dalereed]

"But a 260# - that person is only gona be in the right FRONT SEAT, next to me"

She knew better, she didn't want to sit facing backwards when we left Orange County and was told that she either sat there or stayed home. Worse than that, her ex old man owned a 210 which is much more critical than a Saratoga as far as weight and balance so load placement wasn't any stranger to her.

The only satisfaction I got out of the whole thing is that she sued me for 5 million, had a stupid attorney, turned down $750k and wound up with nothing!

[SuziQ]

PC is the operating system for leftist in this country. When they want to attack someone, they many times start off by calling that person a 'bigot'. HLL was using their tactics. I find that offensive on a conservative website.

I'd suggest you quit while you're not too far behind! You weren't 'ahead' even with your first post!

[agincourt1415]

Hey you PA-32-300 driver's don't know,the PA 32 - 260 has a higher useful load than a -300.

Me I flew out of Marsh Harbor, Bahamas on a hot summer day with 1600# (30# below gross) and I'm at 200' mid field.

The Six I fly, flew with Air America in Laos, has some nice changes since then, Q-Tip 3 Blade and the Lighter Alternator.

But then if I had the money I would own a Sara - just would want the nice panel (that will do everything but fix breakfast for you). And retract gear and the speed pickup is nice. Both planes Six or SARA, are the best Airborne SUVs available.

But I do have Skyforce Color Moving Map GPS and that is a joy to Fly with.

[dalereed]

It did have a nice panel, had an L-1011 pilot offer to trade me panels as llong as he could keep his flight director, I only had a 3 axis autopilot fully coupled.

I did take one load from Burbank to Houston that I was 800# over gross but didn't realize it until I got there. We loaded the plane at dusk in the rain using a bathroom scale that stuck at 80#.

Probably the most interesting trips I took was flying live fish boxed in water from Boise to Borego Springs. On takeoff the water surged in the boxes and the plane would lunge forward and then feel like you slamed on the breaks alternatly.