Faith and Values: St. Cloud Bishop Suggests Bringing African Refugees to Minnesota

Star Tribune ^ | Dec. 28, 2002 | Warren Wolfe

[Risa]

Disturbed by the plight of refugees after a two-week visit to Africa, St. Cloud Bishop John Kinney is asking officials in his Catholic diocese to consider bringing refugees to Minnesota.

"Conditions are deplorable in those camps, and millions of people are losing hope after years of dislocation," Kinney said after touring four camps in three countries this month.

He said the United States has admitted 28,000 of the 70,000 refugees authorized under law this year, and he will urge Minnesota Congress members to work to fill the quota.

"But we need to explore what we can do right here, in Minnesota, in the Diocese of St. Cloud, to help alleviate the suffering of our brothers and sisters in Africa," he said.

In the 1970s and '80s, Catholic Charities was among Minnesota social-service agencies that helped thousands of southeast Asian refugees escape the ravages of war, and Kinney said, "I think it is time for us to reenergize our efforts and help people who are suffering in Africa."

Kinney is on the Migration Committee of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops. He visited camps in Kenya, Tanzania and Guinea, where about 200,000 of more than 5 million displaced Africans are living in harsh conditions -- many there for more than 10 years.

"When we look at our blessings -- our luck, really -- of living in such a prosperous country, and we see the suffering of so many elsewhere, we need to ask ourselves what God calls us to do," Kinney said. "I think we do have a call."

[dennisw]

There was no reference here to "tons of refugees." According to the article, the bishop said that "the United States has admitted [only] 28,000 of the 70,000 refugees authorized under law this year." More legal immigrants could come if they had sponsors. Groups like Catholic Charities act as sponsors.

And if were up to you you would bring in 1,000,000 refugees each year. Am I right or am I wrong? I know the 3rd world sucks and has been in apocalypse mode for decades. Are we supposed to be a Noah's Ark for all these trashed nations? Where we bring in a select few "refugees" while millions rot and die?

[ImpeachandRemove]

"When Kinney takes three of these families into his personal residence or, better yet, sells his residence and moves into a rectory and lives like a simple parish priest, then we can take him seriously."

Like the late Bishop Topel of Spokane. Sold the Bishop's house, gave the money to the poor, and moved into an apartment.

cheers, ImpeachandRemove... Hillary!

[JNB]

I am a Catholic myself, and accepting refguees, while doing nothing to deal with the suffering in the refugees home countries is a very short sighted band aid, a feel good solution pushed by those who this migration doesnt impact. I can understand why the US accepted refugees from Vietnam, because of US involvment there, and the fact many of the Vietnamese refugees put their lives on the line to side with the US, but from other countries, all I can say is we need a better way of distrubuteing foreign aid and milti-lateral way of dealing with the dictators that cause these problems, though not by use of force.

Anyways, I chalk this up to another liberal bishop, and as for Catholic Charities, I refuse to donate to them, I rather donate to my parish or St Vincent De Paul, who I know will deal with local poverty issues, rather than act as a liberal social services agency. With this group of bishops, its a struggle to remain a Catholic.

[maxwellp]

American freedom had very little to do with "luck". American history shows that during the American Revolution, we had Americans who were poorly equipped militarily facing the English who had a superb, extremely equipped military force and we won. I'm sorry about the Africans and I would support giving them arms to fight in their own country and be willing to die for their own country, but as Americans fought for America, so must these folks.

[madprof98]

Any more bragging and you're going to be in Pharisee-territory.

And yet you yourself accused the bishop of being a hypocrite because (you assumed) he would not do what Jesus asked of all of us. You and your friends here, most of whom probably claim the name of Christian, want to have it both ways. You want to say that only those who are personally willing to sacrifice should be able to champion the cause of the dispossessed. But you also want to say that anyone who has really shown care for the poor must have some ulterior (evil) motive.

What you will not see is what is most obvious: Our own ancestors (mine, anyway) fled from oppressive regimes somewhere else and worked hard to make life better for their progeny. The poor who try to immigrate here legally are asking for nothing more than that.

Let me tell you more about the situation of the family I know best. These people are Ogoni, from Nigeria. The dictator there was tapping the oil reserves in their homeland and piping them through their ancestral farms (in very leaky above-ground pipes) without offering them any compensation. When a group of the younger men, inspired by American ideals they had learned in school, demanded democracy and economic justice (i.e., payment for their lands and compensation for the oil), they were butchered. Those who wished to save their lives had to flee to nearby countries, where they could not speak the language. The most resourceful sought to immigrate here, and every one of them I know (I know more than twenty of them) is doing very well--through hard work at low wages.

Why on God's earth do you and your buddies hate these people?

[JNB]

Here is a little information about Bishop Kinney
http://www.catholic-hierarchy.org/bishop/bkinney.html

He was appointed a Aux Bp by Paul VI. no doubt chosen by the ultra liberal Abp Jadot who was the papl nuncio in the US during the 70s who was in large part for making elevating Cdl Mahony, Cdl Law, Abp Weakland and so on to being Bishops. I do not know Bp Kinneys stands on other issues, but lets just say the other Bishops from his era are blindly liberal, and see the church more as a social services agency then as the body of Christ set on Earth to save peopels souls.

I agree we must if we can afford to do so help the poor and needy, but there are plenty of people who need help in the US, and again, accepting refugees non stop does nothing to solve the problems of their homelands.

[madprof98]

. . . accepting refugees non stop does nothing to solve the problems of their homelands . . .

Nor does leaving them to die in squalid camps abroad help their homelands. Praise God for Paul VI . . . and shame on you.

[dennisw]

Jewish refugee agencies are out of line too. In their efforts to keep the Gubbermint funds flowing they "advocate" for all kinds of non-Jewish refugees. Even Muslims sometimes.

[Capt. Tom]

When we look at our blessings -- our luck, really -- of living in such a prosperous country, and we see the suffering of so many elsewhere, we need to ask ourselves what God calls us to do," Kinney said. "I think we do have a call."

Sell all that you have. Give it to the poor. Pack up and go over there and help them. - Tom

[madprof98]

Anyone who wonders why so many practicing Catholics continue to support the Democratic party need look no further than this thread. "Compassionate conservatism"? Not here.

[JNB]

Accepting refugees non stop again DOES nothing to solve the root of the problem. The root of the problem is opressive govrenmnets. Has the US dropped the ball in many cases, like with Rawanda, yes, bit again, you want justice, then find a way to install a just govrenmnet in these peoples homelands, or adjust the national boundries in Africa to relect the tribal boundries rather than the boundries that reflect the Colonial ones, this is one of the biggest roots of Africas problems today.

We Should do more to help them in camps, yes, provide food, provide medical supplies, but as another poster said, the US can not nor should not be the Noahs Ark for the world.

As for Pope Paul VI, I am not disputeing his holiness, but so many of the problems in the church today are due to his lack of oversight and leadership. He may have been a very holy man, and a good teaching pope, but the church suffered a great deal under his rule, and from what I read, even he realised the true extent of the damage when he made the "Smoke of Satan has enterd the sanctuary" comment shortly before his death.

[cynicom]

It is a business, if the church sponsors them the government pays. That is how all the somalians ended up in Maine.

[dennisw]

Why on God's earth do you and your buddies hate these people?

Sorry but the 3rd world is damned for whatever reason. I don't pretend to know why. And there are billions more just as desperate as the ones you know. So how many are we supposed to take in each year one million or two million or more? Is there a limit?

[sinkspur]

Why on God's earth do you and your buddies hate these people?

Nobody hates these people.

Go go bed. Your sanctimony is beginning to nauseate.

[JNB]

Actually, in the 00 election, "practiceing" Catholics gave Bush a solid 57% of the vote. What did I say that was not compassionate? I said we should do more to help the refugees in the camps, again, more food, more medical supplies, but what good again is accepting refugees when the main root of the problem is unjust govrenmnets? Again, how many times do I have to repeat this, that is the source of the problem, if the source is not dealt with, the problems will only get worse.

Being compasionate also means taking a long term view of things, not a short term, feel good view of things. Yes, its a feel good thing to take in refugees, but what good does it do to solve the long term problem?

[JNB]

Not all of the 3rd world is dammned, in countries that had just governments(and yes, these are not allways democracies as we understand them), their populations have for themost part not starved, and the level of their prosperity and education has increased. You can even see a example of this in Africa with Botswana(sp), while poor, the people there are not starving to death and they do not have a refugees leaving their country,

[dennisw]

You are 100% correct. There is hope and life in some parts of the 3rd world.

[Risa]

"Total crap. Do you know any refugees? Do you know any African refugees?"

Yes, I have known many refugees, and lived among them, both very good and very bad people.

Had I not witnessed first-hand the havoc and distress brought into American communities by the 'charitable'
creation of a never-ending stream of immigrant/refugees, I would not concern myself with the Bishops plea to help a few refugee families.

Yet, In other American cities, once these religious businesses settle a few refugees, a great chain-migration begins, and thousands follow, sometimes totally disposessing its host community of its original culture.

And it is most often America's poor, both black and white, who must live with the inevitable crime, school crowding, increased property taxes, and other social pressures consequent to an immigration policy which I perceive to be uncontrolled, chaotic and indiscriminate.

One can look to Wausau, Wisconsin; Lewiston, Maine; and numerous other small American communities to get a glimpse of the effects.

You ask what is my problem?

I object to the indiscriminate, annual importing of 1.3 million refugees and immigrants, legal and illegal, without concern for the American citizen and the American culture. I believe immigration needs to be drastically reduced, so we can assimilate those already here. Future policy should reflect the best interests of the country and its people.

I object to any religious organization, such as the Catholic and Lutheran charities, receiving funding from the federal government on a per refugee basis. I believe separation of church and state has served our country well, and these religious organizations should be entirely disconnected from the formation of immigration policy. Further, the immigration lawyers should be disconnected, too.

And I object to the elitist people, many of whom are our elected leaders and lawmakers, who would foist their diversity agenda and transnationalistic ideology onto the backs of the American poor, and then, when the working poor protest or express distress, as is happening in Lewiston, Maine, right now, these same elitists, whose lives are far removed from the actual consequences of their policy, shush them up with accusations of racism and xenophobia, and tell them diversity is hard but good for them.

Risa

[Goetz_von_Berlichingen]

"And they pay for all of it by working three jobs, each at starvation wages, but together it all adds up."

If these are legitimate jobs, then there is no such thing as "starvation wages" in the U.S. The addition of every immigrant to the potential work force helps depress the wages of people who were actually born here. Simple supply and demand: if more workers are willing to work for lower wages, then salaries go down across the board, and unemployment rises. And Third World immigrants WILL work for less money because even the lowest paid job in the U.S. is better than what they could get in their homeland.

So, who is adversely affected? Americans at the low end of the economic spectrum; service and factory jobs.

But if a Somalian refugee can get by on a bowl of rice and minimum wage, why bother hiring a native American who may need more income so that he can save to put his kids through college? If a large family of refugees can fit into a single room, then why shouldn't an American family do the same?

Limousine liberals, with their economically suicidal immigration policies, are busily putting the last nails in the coffin of the American dream, at least of the native-born working class. But then African refugees are so much more exotic and admirable that trailer trash blue collar workers. Charity, apparently, begins anywhere but home.

[junta]

"Luck" BS. My ancestors (Anglo/Saxon and no apologies for being so) made this country out of wilderness, much blood, little luck. My family did not fall off some turnip boat by accident or divine intervention.