McBride Campaigns In Black Church -- IRS Violation?

Fox News Channel - Reporter Carl Cameron ^ | 10/29/02 | TommyDale

[TommyDale]

Once again, the Democrats are shown on national television conducting their campaign in a black church, in full view. When will the IRS start doing something about this violation of the tax exempt rules?

[Texas_Jarhead]

I saw that too but you know that the IRS won't bother. Only whites and republicans break the law just like they are the only acknowledged racists.

[gdani]

uh...could you post some proof..a picture...newspaper story , etc. Otherwise, we don't believe you

I saw Bob Dole in 1996 (or maybe 1995) on Cleveland's near west side. I listen to a conservative radio station (WCCD/1000 am) frequently and, in election season, there are *always* Republican candidates advertising the fact that they will be at such & such a church on a particular Sunday.

Again, I don't know why this is such a suprising phenomenon.

If you don't believe me, I suppose it would be simple enough to get particular candidate's past itineraries.

[Hodar]

Thank you for your response. This was a good day, in that I learned something new. I can understand that with the Free Speech in the counstitution, a political candidate would be free to espouse his beliefs anywhere. I had never heard of this freedom being extended to Republicans before. I would further venture to guess (and guess is the correct word) that as long as the church does not divest funds to a political cause (refer to Gore and his Buddist temple fiasco) there is no IRS conflict.

[longtermmemmory]

So who is calling the IRS? I dont have the where, when information but I would certainly tape the show and call the IRS over this issue. It is time that the laws were fairly enforced.

http://www.IRS.gov would be a good start.

The NAACP is also running radio ads on 93.1 fm blaming bush for denying blacks their votes in 2000. They are scamming it under the "People of the American Way foundation". The are going to have their lawyers available to ensure all those who will be denied their vote will get provisional ballots. The commercial does a direct appeal to felons.

[xkaydet65]

It's not about party it's about the religion. Watch what the furor would be like if a pro life candidate was given the opportunity to speak to the congregation at St. Patrick's Cathedral at the 10:30 Mass this Sunday.

If a church group wants to invite speakers to recognized candidate's nights that's fine, but too many groups Black and White do it during services and get away with it, except for the Catholics. Let them do it and the apocalypse will arrive.

[xkaydet65]

It's not about party it's about the religion. Watch what the furor would be like if a pro life candidate was given the opportunity to speak to the congregation at St. Patrick's Cathedral at the 10:30 Mass this Sunday.

If a church group wants to invite speakers to recognized candidate's nights that's fine, but too many groups Black and White do it during services and get away with it, except for the Catholics. Let them do it and the apocalypse will arrive.

[TommyDale]

"...Only whites and republicans break the law just like they are the only acknowledged racists."

How about this thought: White Republicans are just about the only people who even pay taxes!

[gdani]

I can understand that with the Free Speech in the counstitution, a political candidate would be free to espouse his beliefs anywhere. I had never heard of this freedom being extended to Republicans before. I would further venture to guess (and guess is the correct word) that as long as the church does not divest funds to a political cause (refer to Gore and his Buddist temple fiasco) there is no IRS conflict.

Pastors of 501(c)(3) i.e. non-profit churches can allow or invite candidates to come speak to the congregation so as long as other candidates are not forbidden from doing the same.

What churches can't do is endorse a candidate (or have the pastor do so in their capacity as a pastor), urge their congregation to vote a certain way, or give money to a candidate.

Pastors are also free to speak on any social issue they please so long as they do not engage in electioneering.

If pastors/churches would like to do anything they are not permitted under law to do, the answer is simple - unincorporate. No one forces them to be 501(c)(3).

Unfortunately, many churches (as well as individuals & corporations) are too addicted to that Govt teat.

[Utah Girl]

Where do you live, gdani? I'm LDS, and each year, right before the elections, we get a letter read to us which states what can and can't be done in a meetinghouse/church house. Having the candidates speak as candidates about issues is the biggest no-no, using the meetinghouse to vote in, using memberships for political purposes or contacting people, etc are all big NO's.

[Saundra Duffy]

This only works for Democraps.

[gdani]

I'm LDS, and each year, right before the elections, we get a letter read to us which states what can and can't be done in a meetinghouse/church house. Having the candidates speak as candidates about issues is the biggest no-no, using the meetinghouse to vote in, using memberships for political purposes or contacting people, etc are all big NO's.

Sounds like whomever provides that letter is being extra careful. Too careful, in fact.

IRS guidelines on this are pretty straightforward.

Look specifically at Page 8 "Inviting A Candidate to Speak". (The link is in the sentence above).

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

Churches can lose their tax exempt status for allowing it. If the church allowed it, it deserves whatever (if any) punishment it gets.

Of course you mean, within the law. OTOH were there a flat tax without charitable deductions (or a national sales tax), the government would have no justification for intruding on freedom of religion by proscribing political activism in churches.

As is the clear intent of the First Amendment . . .

[Quick Shot]

He guys it is not illegal to campaign in church, never has been and never will. Freedom of speach, remember that one.......

What is illegal is to pass the plate and do fund raising in a tax exempt organization. If there is not money changing hands there is no problem....

Now what Gore did was collect money at the temple, he should have done time. Ignorance would not protect the rest of us why him.

[gdani]

If there is not money changing hands there is no problem....

Yes there is. As far as the IRS is concerned, it's still a big problem if there are endorsements and/or lobbying by the church.

[South40]

OTOH were there a flat tax without charitable deductions (or a national sales tax), the government would have no justification for intruding on freedom of religion by proscribing political activism in churches. As is the clear intent of the First Amendment . . .

The fact remains that EXISTING law prevents such activities. And breaking the law is more for dimocRATs than conservatives. If campaigning on religious properties is anyone's goal they should seek to change the law. Otherwise, they're no different than any dim.

[Quick Shot]

What you believe the IRS upstages the constitution. They may think so. One can pontificate and say whatever they damn well please (short of fire in a buring church).

Please understand the IRS gets involved because of the flow of money, not words. If there is no flow of money there is no problem.

That was the problem with the Christian Coillition there was a good amount of money flowing around.

You proved my point with your disclaimer, "if there are endorsements and/or lobbying by the church." If the church makes it's facilities available at no cost and does not lobby or pass the plate what did they do wrong?

[au eagle]

When will the IRS start doing something about this violation of the tax exempt rules?

Because there are not enough IRS agents to investigate every black church in America.

[gdani]

Please understand the IRS gets involved because of the flow of money, not words. If there is no flow of money there is no problem.

What I understand is that the IRS, in the past, has fined churches for words, not money, when they have violated the conditions that come with their 501(c)(3) status.

You proved my point with your disclaimer, "if there are endorsements and/or lobbying by the church." If the church makes it's facilities available at no cost and does not lobby or pass the plate what did they do wrong?

That wasn't a disclaimer. It was an addition to your comment that one only need to worry about the money. That's false. They also need to worry about the illegalities of endorsements & lobbying - which both require no money.

If you don't believe me, read the IRS guidelines yourself (I posted a link in an earlier post).

[Robert A Cook PE]

"Lastly, I don't know where you live but Republican candidates do the exact same thing where I live....

Name them.

This is, again, more (ignored) fraud (by the democrats) and (made up/"they all do it") accusations against the republicans.

Here, EVERY church in the county was warned explicitly against even ALLOWING ad papers to be handed OUTSIDE if on church property .... while in NT, Hillary kicked out Catholic members so she could campaign (excise me, preach) inside from the altar.