Posted on 10/20/2002 7:48:19 AM PDT by SamAdams76
The photos above currently on the Drudge site concern me. I followed the link and the article clearly stated that nobody was arrested last night.
Why then, do we have drivers of white vans, innocent civilians, evidently being pulled out vans at gunpoint and treated like dangerous criminals? One photo shows a man on the ground, evidently in handcuffs, with police officers standing over him as though they have just captured Whitey Bulger. When I first saw the photo, I figured the man was obviously a wanted criminal that police just so happened to come across during their search. But since there were no arrests last night, this man was obviously released and was no criminal after all.
The other photo shows a man by another white van with his hands in the air and a police officer has a gun drawn on him. Again, this was evidently just another innocent civilian who had the misfortune to be driving a white van on I-95 last night.
Now I understand the need for these roadblocks and for the police to be very thorough in their search for the sniper(s). But I cannot see the point of innocent people dragged out of their vehicles at gunpoint with no pretext other than the fact that they happen to be driving a white van.
Now maybe somebody here has an explanation why these two individuals were treated like criminals. Maybe they tried to evade the police or maybe they were driving stolen vans. But again, there were no arrests made last night. So what is the deal with our citizens being treated like Jesse James just for driving a white van?
Interesting approach since last I heard at least 5 witnesses have reported 2 mideastern or hispanic males. I guess since we can't profile them that the next best thing is white males since they are virtually the only group in the country with no legal recourse.
Since the 1700s.
I'm not fond of that approach either but at least it gives the occupants a chance to comply with the search without having to be tossed into the street at gunpoint and handcuffed.
A lot of the same people who are complaining about airport screeners NOT looking at middle eastern men are the same ones on this thread screaming because the police are looking at white vans.
You are a master avowing being sucked into extraneous arguments.
I refer you to my post #193 (and others)
As I said before this is NOT unreasonable search and seizure. This is commonsense being performed to catch an escaping killer within minutes of his killing again. Why don't you tell me where this is unreasonable.
Probable cause does not exist. You can say this is commonsense as many times as you like, but that doesn't make it so.
But can authorities do this without compromising the investigation?
2. Authorities should put in place a system where the public can be alerted via radio (Emergency Broadcast System) within minutes that a shooting has occurred at X - be attentive.
Not a bad idea. But would it serve to foster a climate of justice, or a climate of fear? Judging how the media has been characterizing the population around the DC area, a EBS would seem to only foster fear and reclusion. Ultimately, the public would need the mindset that they are willing to put themselves at risk to catch the sniper- and ultimately save the lives of others. I want to have faith that Americans would do this. But I think fear has a pretty tight grip on many citizens in the DC area.
3. Unfortunately, they must mostly rely on a person disrupting the next attempted sniping, or on an acquaintance turning the sniper in.
I agree. Someone in the public knows something. Ultimately, I do think the actions of a private citizen, whether it will be through tips or capture, will get the sniper.
Let's face it, these roadblocks are really meant to give the appearance the police are "on the case". The chances of one resulting in an arrest are nil; the sniper's already prepared for this eventuality.
Well, I do believe that the police have become so steadfast in their 'original' ideas of escape routes, etc., that they have completely shut down all other possibilities or escape routes. The police are looking for obvious answers to a complex crime.
Thank you, NittnayLion, for your considerate reply.
Well the dream is finally over! I posted my answer to this at #193.
Check out post #183 for your answer..
Good story, Egg. The coppers are sh!t up a creek enough without citizens getting all hissy about having to undergo traffic searches... People's lives are at stake. If I owned a white van, the cops could search it anytime.
BUMP
Well, let's get theoretical then...
For the sake of arguement, let us say there is no better method available, you will argue then that pulling white vans over randomly and checking them at gun point without probable cause is a greater crime (against our rights, perpetrated by the government, in this instance) than the murders of these 9 (maybe 10), and the attempted murder of the 2 who have survived.
That is how I understand your case: It is better to let the killers continue killing than to engage in this kind of police action.
OK. I'll accept your position at face value (though, I must note, I don't agree with it.
In your consideration, does there come a point where your position changes regarding this method (of police work)? Say the killer(s) continued on in this pattern 4 more months and 50 people have been killed. Does that change your mind?
What if this kind of sniper pops up in five more states with similar success, so now there are 250 people dead. Does that make a difference?
Are there any number of deaths, is there a limit (in theory), any amount of disruption that would move you off your current position?
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