Benito Mussolini - Conservative or Liberal?

self

[Commander8]

Mussolini was actually an anarchist early in his career until Italy's post WWI finacial crisis created a power vaccuum which he filled. Actually when I discuss anarchists, I use Mussolini as an example of what happens when anarchists get their way.

[rudypoot]

Being tough on crime is not exclusively right or left. It is the method of which they fight crime that makes them left or right.

Hitler was anti-commy too. Heck, didn't he invade Russia??

Just because he was anti-union didnt mean he was a conservative. He wanted the government to retain power over the economy (that's leftist). Back then, unions were actually needed. Unions are quite different now-a-days.

Making trains run ontime and fighting corruption ain't partisan issues. Name one government in modern times that don't have corruption.

I think you are missing the point: It's the methods and idealogy that make you right or left, not the results of the method.

[TransOxus]

Hitler and Mussolini believed in their own form of communism - Nazism and Fascism. Why have imported icons of socialism when you can found your own home-made brand created with themselves as the gods to worship. That is why they were against the competing Marxist-Russian model of comummunism.

[CatoRenasci]

Actually, Victor Emmanuel III detested Mussolini because he was not a gentleman. Italian politics in the 19th and 20th centuries are confusing, but the House of Savoy was definitely liberal in the classical European sense and hostile to the Church, as was Garibaldi and almost the whole of the Northern Italian aristocracy and bourgeoisie, because in the late 19th and early 20th centuries the Church was strongly identified with ultramontagne elements in France and reactionary elements in Italy. I had a greatgrandfather who was a Garibaldini (1860 and 1866) and heard much of this history from one of my grandfathers.

[John Lenin]

FACIST !

[Brush_Your_Teeth]

Just because he was anti-union didnt mean he was a conservative. He wanted the government to retain power over the economy (that's leftist). Back then, unions were actually needed. Unions are quite different now-a-days.

I agree 100% just look at any communist country and see how their "offical" unions under the control of government ran. Chavez is a communist yet he is attacking unions as we speak by creating the same type of offical government union.

[the gillman@blacklagoon.com]

Fascist is a Nazi who has to invent his mythical glorius past. They are simply nationalist in their socialism.
Like democrats, only not as evil.

[A_perfect_lady]

I think it's the "nationalism" that liberals use as an excuse to label him, Hitler, and newer folks on the scene like the assassinated Pim Fortyne as "right wing." They aren't at all right wing, they favor government control, but people never seem to see that classifying Hitler and some little militia group in Montana together is illogical. They dub them both "nationalist" and then label that "right wing" so that they'll have fearsome entities at both extremes, in order to scare the sheeple toward the "middle'" (which they have moved way to the left.)

[the gillman@blacklagoon.com]

A wise man once said, "When a leftist insults you he is confessing his sins."

They call us Nazis because they are Nazis. They accuse us of destroying the environment but they burn the forests.
They call us rascists but Jackson/Sharpton/affirmative action/mandatory bilingualism = rascism. They call us sex-obsessed when we call Clinton a traitor, although we are talking nukes and missile technology (N. Korea!)they are talking Monica.

Like the kids argument, " I know you are but what am I?"

[jstone78]

>>>>Actually, Victor Emmanuel III detested Mussolini because he was not a gentleman.<<<<<

I think the differences between Mussolini and the King, were a matter of style, rather than substance.

Certainly, the King, like other members of the Italian and European aristocracy, detested the crude and unenlightened methods that Mussolini and his supporters used in dealing with their opponents. The ideas of the enlightenment had a great impact on how the European aristocrats of the 1920s viewed the world.

But King Victor Emmanuel III was glad to accept the new territories that Mussolini had conquered on his behalf, in that he gladly assumed the titles of King of Albania and Emperor of Ethiopia, following the brutal conquest of those hapless lands by Mussolini's military.

And, after the war, the Italian people turned against their King because of his 20 year association with Mussolini, and they forced him to abdicate his throne in 1946. But even that measure did not appease the angry Italians, and they voted to get rid of the monarchy shortly thereafter.

[CatoRenasci]

Actually, the referendum that eliminated the monarchy in Italy after the war was a close run thing, won by the antimonarchal forces only because of strong US pressure. The Brits protested US interference strongly.

Victor Emmanuel III, though personally very decent, was a weak man, acquiescing in Mussolini's rise to power in 1922 because he feared civil war, and did not trust his military to stop Mussolini. Having done so, he was 'in for a penny, in for a pound' as the Brits say.

Aristocratic distaste with the fascists and nazis was widespread. Growing up, I knew a number of German and Italian aristocrats who left Europe in the 30's because they could not stomach the regimes.

[f.Christian]

Main Entry: fas·cism
Pronunciation: 'fa-"shi-z&m also 'fa-"si-
Function: noun
Etymology: Italian fascismo, from fascio bundle, fasces, group, from Latin fascis bundle & fasces fasces
Date: 1921
1 often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
2 : a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control < early instances of army fascism and brutality -- J. W. Aldridge >
- fas·cist /-shist also -sist/ noun or adjective, often capitalized
- fas·cis·tic /fa-'shis-tik also -'sis-/ adjective, often capitalized
- fas·cis·ti·cal·ly /-ti-k(&-)lE/ adverb, often capitalized

[CatoRenasci]

And the definition (from a descriptive dictionary, no doubt) is relevant becaue....

If you are seriously interested in undestand the state socialist movements in Europe in the 1930s, you must read Ernst Nolte's The Three Faces of Fascism, which you should be able to find used pretty easily. Outstanding book, and a real eye opener, especially on the Action Francais.

[F16Fighter]

Mussolini is what happens when Hollywood goes political.

[f.Christian]

Wouldn't fascism be the 3rd way---pre-two/socialism....

voluntary slavery/dictatorship like Iraq---to cuba!

Fake markets---elections...hyper rallies!

[weikel]

Mussolini was NOT anti semitic he was just afraid of Hitler( the Italian army was no match for the Wehrmarcht). During his puppet leader period after being deposed( then rescued and restored by Germany) in 1943 he did everything he could to stop any deportation of jews from Italy.

[weikel]

The American occupying forces helped influence the Italians to depose the monarchy( Truman was a Democrat, though I believe a dupe of the communistinfested State Department rather than an actual communist like Woodrow Wilson was, and Democrats hate all monarchies because monarchs tend to be almost without exception foes of totalitarianism and communism all communist revolutions have been preceded by non communist ones abolishing a countries monarchy).

[LibWhacker]

A friendly reminder to all tyrants everywhere.