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Maryland Sniper Shootings Update Thread
CNN, Fox, Local Radio and Television | October 8, 2002 | CNN, Fox, Breaking News

Posted on 10/08/2002 3:36:37 AM PDT by Peach

It's 6:30 a.m. EST and we're waiting to go to the second press conference providing media and local updates on the Maryland sniper shootings. To date, the 13 year old boy has survived the evening and seems to be improving. Fox News mentioned that his aunt is a nurse. The police briefing at 6:15 a.m. mentioned Todd Beamer's Let's Roll comment and police are urging people to use caution, good judgment, but remain strong and try to continue with everyday life as much as possible.

Police had a search warrant last night (didn't say for who or where) related to the sniper shootings, but the search did not provide any information to LEO.


TOPICS: Breaking News; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: District of Columbia; US: Maryland; US: Virginia
KEYWORDS: banglist
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To: twigs
I'm not convinced it is terrorist-related, but I'm certainly not convinced it's not!

Same here ... I just think it WAY more likely that this is one of our patented homegrown wackos.

221 posted on 10/08/2002 7:25:32 AM PDT by iconoclast
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To: blackdog
I'd wear Kevlar on opening day of deer season,

Sounds good!

222 posted on 10/08/2002 7:25:36 AM PDT by ET(end tyranny)
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To: blackdog
I am sure there are not too many places you can practice shots like this without being witnessed.

Sure there are. You're thinking the guy goes to the shooting range, but he could also just head up to the hills for some "hunting".

223 posted on 10/08/2002 7:26:37 AM PDT by r9etb
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To: iconoclast
I don't think very many people here are CONVINCED one way or the other. We are all theorizing, as are the feds and all LEO.
224 posted on 10/08/2002 7:26:50 AM PDT by Peach
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To: ET(end tyranny)
If I haven't done anything wrong, then why should I be bothered with them looking around? They wouldn't find anything illegal. I would however want them to give a reason for wanting to search.

They would have no specific reason; just because they want to check, would be the reason. That's what I'm getting at. I have no objection to a search of my home or wire tap on my phone, IF THEY HAVE A COURT ISSUED WARRANT.

Now, for the police to seize information - a firing pin fingerprint - from private property, is akin to the police taking my DNA and keeping it on file, "just in case." Or, them taking my privacy by searching my house or tapping my phone, again, "just in case." This violates the presumption of innocence. Of course, that presumption attaches strictly only to people, but the idea should extend to everyone and everything.

It has more uses than that. It prevents someone from buying on time and then not making their payments. Don't make the payment, disable the vehicle. Sounds good to me. Makes reposession much easier. Business people need ways to protect themselves from the criminal elements in society to.

With the remote-control kill switch proposal, it would be available to businesses. It would be in the hands of the police to decide when to turn off your automobile.

In a free society, the job of the police ought to be difficult It should take a great deal of effort to strip a person of their precious liberty. The police should have a very hard time convincing judges and juries to fine, imprison, or execute someone.

In a society which has given up essential liberty for temporary safety, it's easy for the police to control the citizens...

225 posted on 10/08/2002 7:27:10 AM PDT by Chemist_Geek
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To: Peach
Peach....Sorry for the loss of your friend.
226 posted on 10/08/2002 7:27:14 AM PDT by Mixer
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To: Dick Bachert
These morons MAY have some surprises if they try this crap down south.

This is a situation that points at the ridiculous and debilitating position such tight gun laws place citizens in.

The perp has the weapons, the average citizen is discouraged from having one.

This county now has the ATF, FBI, homeland security, and surrounding counties volunteering police aid, etc. There was a time that even w/o these resources the community would team up and network to respond quickly to the next incident.

How inpracticable would it be for an armed citizens/authorites combo to be prepared to block roads within a reasonable circumference of the next shooting? Allowing no exit or enterance while the search is conducted?

Personally, I would rather position myself in line of danger to actually DO something to catch the monster than just remain positioned in danger as a sitting duck.

227 posted on 10/08/2002 7:27:41 AM PDT by GirlNextDoor
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To: Peach
"Was WND the only source for the two Hispanic looking men?

I seem to recall something said early on in a press conference on tv last week, but it was like one time only--didn't hear anything on that detail after than. Sometimes WND is "borderline".

228 posted on 10/08/2002 7:28:03 AM PDT by two23
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To: browardchad
The shootings started on Wednesday evening...The DOJ arrested the Oregon cell members on Friday morning...it is a bizarre coincidence that Moose is the former Portland police chief.

Were the arrests completely secret? Or did they have any inkling that they were coming?

229 posted on 10/08/2002 7:28:32 AM PDT by twigs
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To: CobaltBlue
Also, the FBI has clearly determined that the anthrax came from a US lab. The culture was almost pure anthrax, and was treated with an electric charge that caused the spores to repel each other, the opposite of static cling. It was probably made by someone who worked at Ft. Detrick, or was stolen by someone who worked at Ft. Detrick.

The FBI has not stated this in fact the FBI has stated that it was treated with a chemicla that prevented the spores from clumping.

Why would a Middle Eastern terrorist target Daschle and Leahey? Wouldn't Lieberman or another high profile Jew be a more likely target?

Why not they are government officials and such targeting could be seen as causing dissension within the government of the USA. One may resonably presume that the folks at Al Qaeda have at least heard the phrase "Divide and Conquer."

>The equipment needed to provide that specific electron charge is neither cheap nor easily available and at least according to releases in the autum of last year the anthrax spores were specifically chemically treated rather than being given the type of static charge you cite. I would very much like to see an FBI source that stated that the anthrax was definitely treated this way rather than from something from some leftist professor who has an ax to grind.

230 posted on 10/08/2002 7:29:17 AM PDT by harpseal
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To: iconoclast; twigs
I'm not convinced it is terrorist-related, but I'm certainly not convinced it's not!

Same here ... I just think it WAY more likely that this is one of our patented homegrown wackos.

Any incident that keeps people in their homes in fear and causes lunchtime at the schoolyard to be held sctriclty inside is terrorism. Maybe not the kind that pray to Allah but terrorism nonetheless.

231 posted on 10/08/2002 7:29:24 AM PDT by Mixer
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To: CobaltBlue
It could be arab. I know a guy of ME decent that shaved and is calling himself Italian. Anyway, within a 2.5 hour ride of DC there is enough farmground that a couple of guys this summer could have hunted groundhog and never return to the same farm twice. Groundhog hunting produces shots anywhere from 100 to 500 yards. Also, withing that same 2.5 hours are the mountains. Hell we shoot all the time at our cabin and nobody pays any attention. All you need is a little practice, and a pretty good firearm and you too can complete shoots at 300 yards.
232 posted on 10/08/2002 7:30:46 AM PDT by cork
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To: Polybius
If this technology helps us enlist the help of the gun to separate the murderes amongst us from the vast majority of law abiding gun owners, that is good for everybody except the murderer.

Excellent post, and would apply to any technology used to help locate and arrest criminals.

233 posted on 10/08/2002 7:31:00 AM PDT by ET(end tyranny)
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To: Quilla; Squantos; harpseal; Shooter 2.5
Thomson Contenders with good loads regularly shoot sub MOA in competition, the world record pistol group is about 5 shots in 4 inches at 600 yards from a T/C Contender. With a rest (sand bag over car door for example) hitting a torso at 500 yards would be a snap for a Contender. Don't make the common mistake of equating barrel length and accuracy. Sight radius does not apply with optics, longer barrel length just means greater muzzle velocity in the same loads.
234 posted on 10/08/2002 7:31:21 AM PDT by Travis McGee
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To: iconoclast
I do not think it's Arabs.

Remember, many of us believed that Timoty McVeigh was a homegrown terrorist. As it seems to be turning out, he had Iraqi connections. So even if this is a military- or LE-trained marksman, that does not mean he is not connected to terrorists. Unfortunately.

235 posted on 10/08/2002 7:32:25 AM PDT by twigs
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To: Mixer; Peach
Peach....Sorry for the loss of your friend.

Same here.

236 posted on 10/08/2002 7:33:21 AM PDT by iconoclast
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To: Chemist_Geek
RE: Post #55---good points, however on your comment:

"I have no objection to a search of my home or wire tap on my phone, IF THEY HAVE A COURT ISSUED WARRANT.

I think the Patriot Act pretty much wiped that out. I believe LE can now search and seize without a warrent. If anyone knows otherwise, please post.

237 posted on 10/08/2002 7:33:23 AM PDT by two23
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To: GirlNextDoor
One thing is a certainty. The deer in the countryside near Montgomery County MD will sleep better this season. If they don't catch this person I don't think I would want to be walking around fields in or around DC carrying a rifle this year.
238 posted on 10/08/2002 7:34:24 AM PDT by blackdog
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To: ovrtaxt
Does anybody know the status of Maryland/Virginia's conceal carry laws?

BWAHH!!! HA!!! Ha!!! ha!!! A Maryland conceal carry law for regular, honest, citizens?!?! Maryland is one of the most liberal states in the nation. The state has been controilled by DemocRATs for 40 years. A Kennedy (read stupid, liberal, but with name recoginition) is now running for gov. Maryland will nevr allow honest people to protect themselves. In Maryland, if you protect yourself, you go to jail...

239 posted on 10/08/2002 7:35:23 AM PDT by 69ConvertibleFirebird
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To: walkingdead
This mom doesn't know anything about guns (at least for now) so I can't comment on the technicalities you mentioned. It's very interesting what you said about each weapon being set to the shooter. So do we have 1 weapon for 2 equally skilled shooters or 2 weapons for 2 shooters with different skills? I tend to favor the second because it seems to me a very skilled shooter wouldn't want to use someone else's rifle or would be able to adjust its aim. So I think we have 2 shooters and 2 rifles.

Also I posted on another thread:

I thought the perps were AQ too until I read a post mentioning someone's comments about he/they being addicted to violent video games and wanting to get a new level of thrill by shooting real people instead of virtual ones. Considering the extreme level of violence of some of the more "realistic" games on the market nowadays, I do find this hypothesis very interesting and wouldn't be surprised at all if it were the case. They might even be school age kids and it would shed a different light on the last shooting.

So, do we have 2 young adult killers playing very violent video games and each having access to a rifle?

240 posted on 10/08/2002 7:35:45 AM PDT by Elenya
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