Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Freep KMart on exit-door search policy

Posted on 09/02/2002 3:02:49 PM PDT by Sparqi

Recently I was stopped on my way out of KMart by an employee asking to see my receipt and contents of my bags. I asked if I was suspected of doing something illegal to which he replied, "No, it's just our policy to match purchases against your receipt." I told him that unless he had reasonable cause to believe that I'd done something illegal there was no way I was going to let him inspect either one. To his credit, he did not press the issue and allowed me to leave.

The practice of door-checking seems to have started at either Fry's Electronics in California or perhaps at PriceClub/Costco. In the latter case they can enforce the inspection policy because there is actually a clause in the Costco membership agreement which specifically states that a condition of membership is granting them the right to inspect as you leave. (This is why I don't have a Costco membership.) Fry's has been doing inspections for some time, giving rise to the perjorative term "Door-Nazis". Many people such as myself simply walk by the checkpoint and refuse to stop, since Fry's is not a membership store. Essentially they take advantage of your good nature and ask you to voluntarily waive your freedom (and your dignity) to help them control their shrinkage.

Until recently the Fry's policy was really a local issue, confined to California and some western states; so I never really pursued any activism against them...aside from personally advocating to other people that the practice was an insult and explaining that while Fry's can of course *request* that you stop and allow inspection that they cannot *force* you to stop if they don't have probable cause. Now that KMart is doing this, I think it's national enough to warrant a Freep. Here's what I'm proposing:

1. Make it a point to not be cowed into consenting to the search. If they ask to inspect your purchases, ask them if they suspect you of doing anything illegal. This establishes that they do or don't have cause to stop you. Remember; once you've paid for your purchases and they've accepted the payment, you are carrying personal property and they have cannot search you unless they have probable cause such as evidence of shoplifting.

2. If they admit that they don't have cause, tell them you don't consent to being searched and leave. If they press the issue, remind them that the Fourth Amendment guarantees your right against illegal searches. (Sometimes this is hard to explain, because the checker is not an American citizen.) If they try to restrain you, don't fight them or put up a physical struggle. Ask to speak to the most senior manager of the store immediately. Point out to him or her the illegality of the situation and ask if they're prepared to defend their actions in a court of law.

3. Instruct your friends/family/co-workers on the issue. Make sure they understand that what KMart is doing is an insult and a violation of their basic rights.

...dtw


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism
KEYWORDS: 4thamendment; constitution; fourthamendment; illegalsearch; kmart
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 121-140141-160161-180 ... 241-258 next last
To: sinkspur
If you have a trashy house in Hendersonville, NC, and five neighbors complain, and the code enforcers get a warrant they can check out your pig sty and make you clean it up.

But what about our Constitutional right to fill the neighborhood with rats and vermin?

141 posted on 09/02/2002 7:32:54 PM PDT by Roscoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 102 | View Replies]

To: sinkspur
"We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone."

That didn't work for Lestor Maddox (later governor) in Atlanta, Georgia, years ago at his chicken resturant, because the feds found out-of-state license plates on cars in the parking lot and said he was engaging in interstate commerce.

142 posted on 09/02/2002 7:34:24 PM PDT by gatex
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 77 | View Replies]

To: gatex
Lester Maddox was a racist idiot who refused to serve blacks.

If I refuse to allow you to shop in my store because you won't allow me to check your plastic sacks or shopping cart before you leave and compare it to the receipt, I am discriminating on the basis of....what?

143 posted on 09/02/2002 7:43:16 PM PDT by sinkspur
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 142 | View Replies]

To: PeaceBeWithYou
I don't mind them asking for it as I am used to it. However I consider it a nuisance
144 posted on 09/02/2002 7:44:02 PM PDT by Kaslin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 140 | View Replies]

To: billbears
I'm not sure how stores treat their employees now (I know a guy who works at Wal-Mart, I'll ask him tomorrow), but when my mother worked at Memco almost twenty years ago, the employees had to check their personal bags with the security guy in the warehouse where all on-duty emplyees were required to enter/exit. The guard also checked their packages when they left if they'd bought anything between clocking out and leaving.

Of course, the night manager was cooking the books and pocketing a bunch of money from the tills...

As for customers, it was store policy, IIRC to staple shut bags and put the proprietary "tape of the day" on the bag, or anything too big to fit in a bag.

The guard by the customers' exit (usually an off-duty cop) scanned for the sacred tape as you passed.
145 posted on 09/02/2002 7:47:14 PM PDT by PLMerite
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 73 | View Replies]

To: supercat
Well, as long as you aren't concealing stuff, it's ok... if you shove something from the back of the store into your pocket, and then go past the purchase point, technically you could get busted...

Personally, I'd let common sense dictate my actions, and act accordingly... but maybe that's just me ;0)

146 posted on 09/02/2002 7:53:05 PM PDT by Chad Fairbanks
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 89 | View Replies]

To: Prodigal Son
The store can do it too if they have a good strong reason to think you stole something.

Ummm... not in THIS state - they have to see you select an item from within the store and conceal it. Then, and only then, could they detain you. At that point, if you refuse to turn the item over, they would be forced to call the police and THEY would perform the search...

147 posted on 09/02/2002 7:58:35 PM PDT by Chad Fairbanks
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 137 | View Replies]

To: Kaslin
Well, if you card is ever stolen and the theif is caught before he has a chance to charge a large amount or even max it out, and before you report it stolen, or even know it's gone, you may not think that it is such a nusiance.

You do realize that you are responsible for the amount charged on the card up until you report it stolen or lost, and after that you're responsible only for the deductable amount. The former could be as much as your card limit, while the latter is usually $50-$100.
148 posted on 09/02/2002 8:01:46 PM PDT by PeaceBeWithYou
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 144 | View Replies]

To: sinkspur; USA21; MarthaNOStewart
And what about those that have lived in Hendersonville all their lives? I guess they don't have rights do they? Having lived for seven years in the mountains of North Carolina the main reason for this intrusion is NOT to keep out undesirables. It's main purpose is to maintain the value of the land that the d#mn yankees have purchased in the past 10-15 years. Some fruitloop in Southern Living back in the late 80s rediscovered the Southern mountains(Brevard, Hendersonville, Asheville) and ever since the population has exploded with people out of state redefining the entire region.

The cost of living has skyrocketed and the entire area has turned into a cross between Berkley CA with hippies and South Florida with retirees. Most of the jobs in the region are low paying service jobs catering to the implants. The only people that don't 'fit' in are Southerners that were born and raised in this state. The area has never been a dump, but yes there may be a car or two out in the yard being worked on.

News flash!!! This is the South, we work on our cars out in the yard, we listen to country music, and by God we might have a fishing boat somewhere in the back. If you don't like the way it's done, I suggest YOU move. But don't tell others how they can live in a place that they grew up in. It's bad manners, heck it's downright northern.

I know this is off topic of the thread and try not to do that, but your response, sad to say, is without knowledge of the situation in western NC

149 posted on 09/02/2002 8:25:10 PM PDT by billbears
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: billbears
You sound bitter. Try my suggestion -

4. Quit yer bitchin' and get over it.

150 posted on 09/02/2002 8:29:19 PM PDT by Libloather
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 149 | View Replies]

To: Roscoe
Its all over for America
151 posted on 09/02/2002 8:30:29 PM PDT by USA21
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 141 | View Replies]

To: USA21
Its all over for America

Nearly every day. :)

152 posted on 09/02/2002 8:32:44 PM PDT by Roscoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 151 | View Replies]

To: breakem
To be fair to Costco, they have caught a double charge for an item. When I buy two, they always ask (while looking at the receipt) if I really bought two.
153 posted on 09/02/2002 8:33:15 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Chad Fairbanks
Personally, I'd let common sense dictate my actions, and act accordingly... but maybe that's just me ;0)

I make sure to be VERY open about it. I figure that the worst that can happen (and it hasn't yet) would be for someone to ask me to leave the unpurchased items on the "unpurchased" side of the register, but that's never happened. I have on a couple of occasions had someone call out to me (when my current bearing was straight for the door), but I stated my intention and they indicated to go ahead.

BTW, do you have any answer to me other question re someone who is caught (or better yet, videoed) tampering with an anti-shoplifting tag, UPC code, or other such item? My thinking would be that the act of tampering is criminal in and of itself, independent of any effort to take the item from the store. As such, the store would (especially if it had reasonably clear video evidence) have the right to detain the "shopper" when he tried to leave the store and have him searched. Since there'd already be probable cause for his arrest and prosecution, there'd be no problem if a search turned up nothing. Of course, if the store waits until he's ready to leave it may be able to nail him on a much stiffer charge.

154 posted on 09/02/2002 8:33:35 PM PDT by supercat
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 146 | View Replies]

To: dalereed
"The Home Depot stores in the L.A. area are doing the same thing."

My brother worked at a Home Depot in the Dallas area. They told him that he was catching to many thiefs. He quit.

155 posted on 09/02/2002 8:34:13 PM PDT by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: Libloather
Get rid of the implants in the state of NC that keep changing our laws to fit their world views and I'll consider it.
156 posted on 09/02/2002 8:35:50 PM PDT by billbears
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 150 | View Replies]

To: Chad Fairbanks
1. They select an item...

2. They conceal the item...

Once this occurs, you must maintain visual contact with that individual 100% of the time until they leave. If you don't, you could not stop them (they may have "dropped" it on another shelf when they were out of site...)...

Arizona may be the only state that has a specific law against concealing an item inside a store, then leaving without it. It was passed during a fad for the practice you descdroibe a few years ago.

157 posted on 09/02/2002 8:37:47 PM PDT by BlazingArizona
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: USA21; Admin Moderator
Its all over for America

Shouldn't this be breaking news?

158 posted on 09/02/2002 8:38:00 PM PDT by Libloather
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 151 | View Replies]

To: No Truce With Kings
Employee theft is a bigger problem than customer theft. Employees have much more opportunities.

Some just don't seem to realize this....Cashiers working with bogus customers is a billion dollar business........

159 posted on 09/02/2002 8:38:49 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: blam
What did he do, catch the store manager hygrading the merchandise?

The home office told the manager at the Oceanside, CA store to either cut down on the theft or he would be replaced so I don't think it's a company policy to not catch thieves.
160 posted on 09/02/2002 8:38:50 PM PDT by dalereed
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 155 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 121-140141-160161-180 ... 241-258 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson