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A clear and present danger: Ashcroft scheme simply chilling
HoustonChronicle.com ^ | Aug. 16, 2002, 7:49PM | Turley is a professor of constitutional law at George Washington University, in Washington, D.C.

Posted on 08/18/2002 12:31:24 PM PDT by BellStar

ATTORNEY General John Ashcroft's announced desire for camps for U.S. citizens he deems to be "enemy
combatants" has moved him from merely being a political embarrassment to being a constitutional menace.

Ashcroft's plan, disclosed earlier this month but
little publicized, would allow him to order the
indefinite incarceration of U.S. citizens and summarily
strip them of their constitutional rights and access
to the courts by declaring them enemy combatants.

The proposed camp plan should trigger immediate
congressional hearings and reconsideration of
Ashcroft's fitness for this important office. Whereas
al-Qaida is a threat to the lives of our citizens,
Ashcroft has become a clear and present threat to our liberties.

The camp plan was forged at an optimistic time for
Ashcroft's small inner circle, which has been carefully
watching two test cases to see whether this vision
could become a reality. The cases of Jose Padilla and
Yaser Esam Hamdi will determine whether U.S. citizens
can be held without charges and subject to the
arbitrary and unchecked authority of the government.

Hamdi has been held without charge even though the
facts of his case are virtually identical to those in
the case of John Walker Lindh. Both Hamdi and Lindh
were captured in Afghanistan as foot soldiers in
Taliban units. Yet Lindh was given a lawyer and a
trial, while Hamdi rots in a floating Navy brig in
Norfolk, Va.

Last week, the government refused to comply with a
federal judge who ordered that he be given the
underlying evidence justifying Hamdi's treatment. The
Justice Department has insisted that the judge must
simply accept its declaration and cannot interfere with
the president's absolute authority in "a time of war."

In Padilla's case, Ashcroft initially claimed that the
arrest stopped a plan to detonate a radioactive bomb in
New York or Washington, D.C. The administration later
issued an embarrassing correction that there was no
evidence Padilla was on such a mission. What is clear
is that Padilla is an American citizen and was
arrested in the United States -- two facts that should
trigger the full application of constitutional rights.

Ashcroft hopes to use his self-made "enemy combatant"
stamp for any citizen whom he deems to be part of a
wider terrorist conspiracy.

Perhaps because of his discredited claims of preventing
radiological terrorism, aides have indicated that
a "high-level committee" will recommend which citizens
are to be stripped of their constitutional rights and
sent to Ashcroft's new camps.

Few would have imagined any attorney general seeking to
re-establish such camps for citizens. Of course,
Ashcroft is not considering camps on the order of the
internment camps used to incarcerate Japanese American
citizens in World War II. But he can be credited only
with thinking smaller; we have learned from painful
experience that unchecked authority, once tasted,
easily becomes insatiable.

We are only now getting a full vision of Ashcroft's
America. Some of his predecessors dreamed of creating a
great society or a nation unfettered by racism.
Ashcroft seems to dream of a country secured from
itself, neatly contained and controlled by his
judgment of loyalty.

For more than 200 years, security and liberty have been
viewed as coexistent values. Ashcroft and his aides
appear to view this relationship as lineal, where
security must precede liberty.

Since the nation will never be entirely safe from
terrorism, liberty has become a mere rhetorical
justification for increased security.

Ashcroft is a catalyst for constitutional devolution,
encouraging citizens to accept autocratic rule as their
only way of avoiding massive terrorist attacks.

His greatest problem has been preserving a level of
panic and fear that would induce a free people to
surrender the rights so dearly won by their ancestors.

In A Man for All Seasons, Sir Thomas More was
confronted by a young lawyer, Will Roper, who sought
his daughter's hand. Roper proclaimed that he would cut
down every law in England to get after the devil.

More's response seems almost tailored for
Ashcroft: "And when the last law was down and the devil
turned round on you, where would you hide, Roper, the
laws all being flat? This country's planted thick with
laws from coast to coast and if you cut them down --
and you are just the man to do it -- do you really
think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then?"

Every generation has had Ropers and Ashcrofts who view
our laws and traditions as mere obstructions rather
than protections in times of peril. But before we allow
Ashcroft to denude our own constitutional landscape, we

must take a stand and have the courage to say, "Enough."

Every generation has its test of principle in which
people of good faith can no longer remain silent in the
face of authoritarian ambition. If we cannot join
together to fight the abomination of American camps, we
have already lost what we are defending.

Turley is a professor of constitutional law at
George Washington University, in Washington, D.C.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: enemycombatants; saditionest; wrongheaded
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To: atlaw
Battlefield conditions? Am I missing something?

Clearly.

181 posted on 08/19/2002 6:39:55 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: lepton
who are captured in combat on the side of foreign armies?

HRC has already defined anti-abortion protesters as 'terrorists.'

As pointed out above, she can also define anyone else as 'terrorist,' as well, and incarcerate at will.

THAT will precipitate a very interesting crisis, as there are a whole lot of LEO's that will NOT enforce illegal orders. Hmmmmm

182 posted on 08/19/2002 6:49:05 PM PDT by ninenot
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To: atlaw
You are not following the thread. I have already addressed these issues several times. I am not the one that ruled in Ex Parte Quirin. SCOTUS did. But again, those declared "enemy combatants" do NOT have the same rights as US citizen defendants charged in criminal cases.

Again, it is NOT my call. It was SCOTUS, 1942 that differentiated mere citizens from enemy combatants, not I. hell, I wasn't even born...

183 posted on 08/19/2002 6:51:21 PM PDT by donozark
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To: ninenot
As pointed out above, she can also define anyone else as 'terrorist,' as well, and incarcerate at will.

No you can't. Absent a Congressional Authorization to conduct war on an enemy the precedents don't apply nor does the Constitutions granting of extroadinary power to the CIC during wartime for what I thought was readily apparent reasons.

184 posted on 08/19/2002 6:52:13 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Recovering_Democrat
Did the Federal government continue this practice after the War? No.

In WWII, when we finished of Japan the war was over. When will the WOT be over? Heck, we haven't even declared a real war, and our government has told us we're in it for the long run. IMO, the practice will be continued with no end in sight.

185 posted on 08/19/2002 6:52:19 PM PDT by NittanyLion
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To: carenot
Civilian leaders of the military rightly know that we hold them accountable for handling of captured terrorists and suspected terrorists. That doesn't mean we should make them announce to the world every Monday morning the identity of everyone held and the content of their interrogations. That doesn't mean we should open these holding and interrogation centers to every undercover PLO lawyer, serving as a conduit to and from the captured. That information figures importantly in the prosecution of the war. In past wars, that information became available when it was no longer critical to the war effort. So should it nowadays. It is very likely that mistakes will be made in the handling of the captured, as they were in previous wars. Those mistakes will be revealed in time, and the public will decide the proper penalty. If a Middle Easterner is picked up and questioned after leaving a paper trail of banking records showing his possible involvement in the flow of money to Al-Qaeda, and that person is held and interrogated for weeks or months isolated from any help from Al-Qaeda and its political supporters, I don't think the public will be outraged when they learn of it. If a Norwegian national is picked up and held and interrogated for weeks or months because he was overheard to say that Bush is all wrong and that he, personally, hopes the voters choose a Democrat in 2004, there'll be hell to pay. The first example is a proper use of authority during war. The second is an egregious excess not to be tolerated.
186 posted on 08/19/2002 6:56:09 PM PDT by Whilom
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To: Texasforever
one; by one we topple those regimes

...and just how many 'regimes' should we topple?

I thought Clinton was nuts for permanently emplacing American troops as 'peacekeepers;' YOU, on the other hand, will be happy to add 3, 6, 12, or ? MORE countries to our list of dependents.

Perhaps you should study the history of the British Empire (there used to be one) who also placed troops all over the world.

They lost all those possessions/serfdoms.

Thank God I am not one of your grandchildren--I wouldn't want to have to clean up your mess.

187 posted on 08/19/2002 7:05:55 PM PDT by ninenot
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To: Byron_the_Aussie
There's no connection between Saddam and 911

Are you morally certain of this assertion?

In addition, while there have been no more terrorist activities (well, maybe the anthrax was...) to this point, I am not so certain that the 'sleepers' are not waiting for our attack on Saddam, at which time they will pull a few other stunts.

I am VERY willing to force the President to conclude the war when the time has come; OTOH, I am not certain that the terroristas are by any means "done."

188 posted on 08/19/2002 7:09:34 PM PDT by ninenot
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To: donozark
donozark

My apologies for what may appear to be hairsplitting, but it is necessary when discussing legal matters.

The phrase "enemy combatants" appears nowhere in the holdings of Ex Parte Quirin. Please refer to post 163 for the link.

189 posted on 08/19/2002 7:11:00 PM PDT by j271
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To: William Terrell
"Dirty Bomb Suspect has fewer Legal Rights," off CNN.com. June 11. Also, other links for June 10 similar article.
190 posted on 08/19/2002 7:13:37 PM PDT by donozark
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To: Stavka2
Once he joined the military of a recognized foreign power, he lost his citizenship

Citation, please?

THere are at least a few Americans who joined the Israeli Army and NEVER lost their American citizenship.

191 posted on 08/19/2002 7:15:50 PM PDT by ninenot
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To: Recovering_Democrat
ABUSE??? For crying out loud, buy a few guns of your own. Cheaper, quicker, and MUCH more satisfying than an attorney's services.
192 posted on 08/19/2002 7:18:28 PM PDT by ninenot
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To: j271
Not my terms/words. See post 190. CNN-Professor John McGinnis, NW Univ.
193 posted on 08/19/2002 7:18:33 PM PDT by donozark
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To: j271
Oh, and YES the term ENEMY COMBATANT appears in Ex Parte Quirin. 8.
194 posted on 08/19/2002 7:28:43 PM PDT by donozark
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To: jwalsh07
Your comment:"Hamdi was gathered up in Afghanistan with his fellow Al Qaeda pals. Padilla was picked up at Chicago's O'Hare airport after lying about the 10K in cash he came back from Pakistan with. When he left he had only his hands in his pockets, he lied about the amount of cash and he attended some "Al Qaeda" seminars while on holiday. Whats significant about this is that AlQaeda declared war on the US in 1993 at the WTC. That fact has gone right over your head ever since."

My comment: "Battlefield conditions? Am I missing something?"

Your comment: "Clearly."

Fine, Padilla was detained in Chicago. Chicago is not generally known as a battlefield, even in this war. But if it is to be now represented as such, it certainly extends the definition in a way that I am not comfortable with. Battlefield, by this definition, seems to be a euphemism for "wherever the heck we find you," including the town you and I are living in.

Furthermore, you argue the evidence, and if the evidence is that strong, why isn't the government arguing the evidence? There is a dramatic disconnect here. On the one hand, the evidence is so bloody obvious that Padilla ought to be put out to pasture without further consideration. On the the other hand, the government is arguing that there is no need to present evidence of any kind, because ... well, because we're the executive branch and the rest of the pesky branches can go to hell. If the SOB is that obviously guilty, try him and execute him. It's not that hard. Please explain to me why we need to set a remarkably dangerous precedent to deal with this guy.

195 posted on 08/19/2002 7:33:22 PM PDT by atlaw
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To: atlaw
AG Ashcroft is not setting a precedent. See Ex Parte Quirin. 1942.
196 posted on 08/19/2002 7:35:36 PM PDT by donozark
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To: jwalsh07
OK. Let's not use the term 'incarcerate.' Let's use the term 'victimize.' As in, for example, the woman who expressed an opinion about X42 during a parade in Chicago. As in, for example, the not-yet-complete victimization of the ALLEGED killer of Slepian. As in IRS audits until your bank account is exhausted.

Victimize is a better term. Yup. THEN incarceration, after the FBI comes up with "evidence" which fits the prosecutor's needs.
197 posted on 08/19/2002 7:35:48 PM PDT by ninenot
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To: donozark
"Dirty Bomb Suspect has fewer Legal Rights,"
198 posted on 08/19/2002 7:36:55 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: j271
That link doesn't work. no criticism here-but I believe you have a summation of the case conclusions. Not the actual case Ex Parte Quirin, in it's entirety. I got it off caselaw.lp.findlaw.com. "Enemy Combatant" appears.8
199 posted on 08/19/2002 7:38:46 PM PDT by donozark
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To: AaronAnderson
How can we claim that democracy is the greatest form of government when we show it in action by using taliban like tactics such as suspending all the rights of a person and arbitrarly holding them for as long as the government sees fit?

Because we're right, dammit!    </sarcasm>

200 posted on 08/19/2002 7:41:14 PM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts
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