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Experts Find Glocks Prone To Accidents
Syracuse Post-Standard ^ | 8/7/02 | John O'Brien

Posted on 08/07/2002 6:24:01 AM PDT by jalisco555

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To: jalisco555

Do you care about safety? Do you care about fast, accurate shooting? Then avoid the Glock - even though they're cheap. SIG, H%K, even Walther make better guns. And if you've got the time, the money, and the will to get pistoliferous - get the best - 1911 Colt design pistol - Kimber, Para Ordnance, or Springfield brand.

221 posted on 06/12/2004 11:59:55 PM PDT by 185JHP ( "Who is this King of Glory? The Lord strong and mighty, invincible in battle.")
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To: Travis McGee
LOL, talk about bring a thread back from the dead!

Call me brain dead this time of the morning...I just worked a 12 hour Saturday and come home and read a post by our dear friend about a wake up...Even if it was almost two years old it was worth it :O)

222 posted on 06/13/2004 12:30:56 AM PDT by in the Arena ("rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.” ~ Orwell)
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To: in the Arena

It grabbed my attention too!

223 posted on 06/13/2004 12:38:39 AM PDT by Travis McGee (----- -----)
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To: supercat

Early Colts and Remington also were made with a safety pin or cutout on the rear or the cylinders between the percussion cap nipples.

The Walker had one pin; the later Colts one between each chamber.

I designed a custom hammer screw for my vintage Colt .44-40 SA that acts as a positive safety and works just dandy but during the Klintoon years gunmakers and custom part designs were targeted by the government.

I prefer to have all six chambers loaded.

Many very early Colt and S&W DA revolvers had internal safeties.

224 posted on 06/13/2004 12:38:56 AM PDT by devolve (---------------- [--------------Hello from Sunny South Florida-------------)
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LOL, talk about bring a thread back from the dead!

Glad to see I can still get people arguing even after two years. There are still the occasional reports here of negligent discharges with Glocks. I have a Sig which also lacks a mechanical safety. Even a "non-professional" like me knows to keep my finger off the trigger unless I intend to fire.

225 posted on 06/13/2004 2:32:36 AM PDT by jalisco555 ("The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity." W. B. Yeats)
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To: ampat
It seems to me "manual" safeties are good to have. While the glock operator has one safety (i.e. don't pull the trigger), an operator with a manual safety has two (ie. first put the safety on and don't remove it until ready to fire, and don't pull the trigger). Given what I just wrote, you must have two safety failures before you have an AD with a manual safety weapon.

For a thumb-safety to be any good, the shooter must always operate the thumb safety any time the gun is picked up to shoot--even when target-shooting on a range where it would otherwise not be necessary. In a crisis, one is apt to rever to what one practices the most, whether or not it makes sense. If one normally picks up the firearm without switching the safety to "fire", that's what one's likely to do in a crisis, with bad results. And if one normally sets down a firearm without switching it to "safe" [nb: many semi-autos can't be switched to "safe" when the slide is locked back] one is apt to do so immediately following a crisis shooting, also with bad results. With the Glock, there is no reason to handle the gun on the range in a manner significantly contrary to what would be necessary in the field. Provided one always makes sure one's finger is off the trigger before lowering the weapon (whether the slide's locked back or not), and provided one doesn't try to collect brass after each shot, safe gun handling on the range will equate to safe gun handling in real life. Out of curiosity, does anyone know why John Moses Browning designed the 1911 so the slide cannot cycle with the safety on "safe"?

226 posted on 06/13/2004 1:27:43 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)
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To: PatrioticAmerican

how convoluted is removing the magazine, clearing the chamber and keeping one's freakin finger off the trigger...

the only convolution is in your mind... glocks are efficient tools for the well thought shooter...


227 posted on 06/13/2004 7:28:26 PM PDT by teeman8r
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To: supercat

Operating the manual safety is a learned procedure, just as not pulling the trigger until you are ready to shoot.

228 posted on 06/13/2004 10:28:06 PM PDT by ampat
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To: jalisco555
Since my knowledge of firearms is limited I'd appreciate the comments of knowledgable Freepers. I suspect poor training rather than poor design is the problem here.

I see you've already gotten plenty of replies, so I'll keep mine short and to the point..

I would rather you had said "malfunction" instead of "poor design"..
That is because I have always contended that the Glock "safety" system is indeed, poor design..

As pointed out in the article, the weapon operated correctly, as designed and did not malfunction..
Therefore, the blame is placed on the operator..

Sorry, I just don't buy it..
From the introduction of the Glock, I have avoided it, and advised all I know to avoid it..
The accounts above are of people supposedly trained in law enforcement, and often specifically trained in weapons safety with a Glock..
Yet, there is a high incidence of accidental/unintentional discharge..

That can be extrapolated to mean one would expect an extremely high incidence of such discharges among the untrained, occassional user..
The only reason reports have not been exceptionally high, is that among occassional users, the weapon is usually stored, not carried.. it is meant to be used only in "emergencies"..

IMHO, the Glock line of handguns are the most dangerous weapons on the market today..

(Short & to the point, yeah, sure.. LOL )

229 posted on 06/14/2004 2:28:29 AM PDT by Drammach (Ripley... Last survivor of the Nostromo.... signing off....)
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To: RichardW
I think the problem with all of these semi-autos is that there is a round left in the chamber after the magazine is removed, unless all of the rounds are used up

It should be a given that when you remove the magazine you check the chamber. It should also be a given that any time you pick up the weapon, you assume it's loaded, and you check the chamber. Takes a second.
230 posted on 06/14/2004 2:37:02 AM PDT by Kozak (Anti Shahada: " There is no God named Allah, and Muhammed is his False Prophet")
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To: School of Rational Thought

Well, heaven forbid we obey the first law of firearms training. As my instructor taught me: "All guns are loaded, always."

231 posted on 06/14/2004 6:23:23 AM PDT by Andonius_99
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To: bt_dooftlook
Sorry, with Glock there are few if any accidental discharges; they all tend to be negligent discharges

Semantics. I've never "un-intentionally" discharged either of my Glock's, and no one else will either, if they do as you suggest, which really all just boils back down to general respect for firearms that many of us were taught as kids.

232 posted on 06/14/2004 6:36:46 AM PDT by Space Wrangler
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To: ampat
Given what I just wrote, you must have two safety failures before you have an AD with a manual safety weapon.

I had to re-read the entire thread just to find what the heck I said, LOL! As was said earlier in the thread - carry what you're comfortable with, but if it's a Glock, make sure you have a good quality holster that completely covers the trigger. I've carried my 11 year old (bought in '93 I believe) Glock 19 daily for almost 6 years, in both Galco crossdraw and hip holsters, and the only time it has discharged (many, many thousands of times) is when I have pulled the trigger.

233 posted on 06/14/2004 12:17:41 PM PDT by ScreamingFist (Peace through Ignorance)
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Comment #234 Removed by Moderator

To: jalisco555
Sounds like this agency should have issued these instead...

(And they say that only the police can be trusted with firearms.) 

235 posted on 10/09/2007 8:56:15 AM PDT by Redcloak (The 2nd Amendment isn't about sporting goods.)
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To: boris
I never liked the Glock because of ergonomics. The gun is too square and "blocky"; it doesn't fit my hand well.

My sentiments exactly!

I love my S & W!

236 posted on 10/09/2007 8:57:42 AM PDT by airborne (Proud to be a conservative! Proud to support Duncan Hunter for President!)
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To: FOL(iberty)
Silly of those Austrians to think that if you pull the trigger it should fire......clearly bad design.

We could make them need to request fire through a special court with judges offering to complete the action.

Lets go back to maces and whirling stars for the Law Enforcement types who do no good defending themselves from the under privileged.

Great weapon but still dangerous in the hands of an idiot.

237 posted on 10/09/2007 9:03:31 AM PDT by colonialhk (Power and Money,the new mantra of the left!)
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