Posted on 07/28/2002 11:50:51 PM PDT by JohnHuang2
Yep, I am a proud rabble. LOL
OTOH, Smoot-Hawley was a disaster; BIG TIME .
But the farm belt iceberg loves farm bills just as much as this America first iceberg loves the steel tariffs as much as the free trade iceberg loves his new fast track authority and as much as the anti-un iceberg loves his upraised finger to that odious entity..
Prove what you claimed ; using credible sources only ! Galraith et al, will NOT suffice.
Now tell me...what kind of conservatism is that? We over pay for a product and then pay taxes and send the money to those who wanted to sell us their products cheaper in the first place.
Btw...every African country was against that bill. They aren't stupid. They want to work, they don't want handouts.
Pat is a hypocrite, a snakeoil salesman, and , unfortunately, has some FREEPERS utterly fooled.
India, with vast natural resources, went nowhere for 40 years. Hong Kong, with barely enough land for the people to lie down in, had the highest per capita income on the planet within 40 years after freeing their economy (it begin in 1960 when hordes of illiterate peasants flooded the colony. the UK could not afford to support them with the socialism they had at home so it was decided to let the economy rip)
The commerce department has this magic ability to see foreign government subsides that no one else can see.
Currently we have tarrifs on Canadian softwood lumber under the auspices of illegal Canadian subsides, however no one outside the commerce department has the ability to see these imaginary subsides, we have lost this fight at the WTO 4 times in a row and we just keep going back for more abuse and we are going to lose of steel too.
Oh, man! I'm outta here!.......Well, maybe I'll read it first.What a fun "strange bedfellows" thread this will be!
Strange bedfellows indeed. Steel, like oil & gas, is a strategic commodity, vital to the national interests. I don't like tarrifs either, as a rule, but vital interests take precedent.
Farm bill is pork, plain and simple, and will have the opposite effect. Law of unintended consequences.
We should pass laws which provide for zero or very low tariffs with nations that buy approximately the same amount from us as we buy from them. But for nations that sell 2, 3 or 4 times to us as we sell to them, we should impose very large tariffs until the trade comes back in rough balance. This approach is better than imposing large tariffs to protect certain industries, like steel. I contend that it is not really in our interest to trade with china when we buy from them 8 times what they buy from us. If it is not two-way trade, we do not benefit and should thus tax it heavily. In this way we can reduce taxes on production in the domestic economy. We must produce domestically or else we will not be able to consume.
The situation has deteriorated each time. Now, I have to come to the conclusion that our representatives are the worst bargainers in the world or the biggest liars. Your defense of the Constitutional duties of the Congress is the formula for fair trade.
Nations should be free to trade with one another in a partnership basis without being governed by a board of political operatives subject to the control by no one. What we call free trade is in reality the most negotiated and manipulated set of trading rules the world has ever known.
It has actually depressed trade rather than encouraged trade. As proof of this, when one economy falters, the whole world stumbles. We, as a nation, are the consumer market for every manufacturer in the world, without regard for the repayment in kind for the export of our products.
The truth of the matter is, we are expected to share our wealth with every other third world country until we become a third world country. This is the plan for establishing the socialist designed world government dictatorship and we have a number of conservatives that buy this line, hook, line and sinker while maintaining they are for freedom and liberty. What a joke!
Politics determines if 'cheap foreign imports' are good or bad
D.J. TICE
Editorial Writer
Several times in recent months, Washington politicians have moved boldly to defend American industries notably steel and lumber against competition from "cheap foreign imports." The imports in question are made unfairly cheap, it's said, by subsidies and market manipulations from foreign governments.
The Bush administration, backed by Democrats and Republicans in Congress, has hiked tariffs to protect American workers and businesses even though one result, economists agree, will be higher prices for American consumers of cars, homes and a thousand other things.
There's not much to say in defense of such protectionist gifts for special interests. But what's even more embarrassing is the way many politicians' distaste for "cheap foreign imports" passes away like an attack of indigestion when the subject turns to prescription drugs. The U.S. Senate is trying to pass a bill that would allow American-made pharmaceuticals to be "reimported" from Canada, where they sell for lower prices.
Now if there were ever a case of "unfair" foreign competition, this would be it. American drug firms sell drugs cheaply in Canada and other countries mainly because those countries enforce strict price controls. The firms sell drugs into those countries anyway because any sale is better than nothing if the price is higher than the actual cost of making and delivering the pills.
Still, the drug companies have to recoup the underlying cost of developing these drugs someplace. Because of overseas price controls, they have to recover those costs mostly in America's free market. That's why prices here are so much higher.
This is understandably frustrating, particularly for senior citizens who too often lack prescription drug insurance. Many seniors need help getting coverage though not all do. This is the least poor age group in America. While some elderly really must choose between medicine and meals, others choose between medicine and another week in Maui.
In any case, "reimportation" is a potentially costly way to help seniors. It would mean that American politicians are, in the case of drugs, welcoming competition from imported products that have been made cheap entirely by the heavy-handed interference of foreign governments.
If, as the politicians claim, that sort of "below cost" competition threatens to devastate the American steel and lumber industries, and undermine American self-sufficiency in those essential commodities, isn't it likely to harm America's prescription drug industry, too?
One of these policies on "cheap foreign imports" must be wrong. Both may be wrong.
One important difference in the two situations is that the industries government is protecting especially steel are old-line businesses in which America is no longer especially innovative. But pharmaceuticals are a high technology product of the future in which America is the world's undisputed leader.
What's more, in the case of drugs, the only things we're really importing are price controls (admittedly something of a Canadian specialty); the drugs involved are the result of homegrown American ingenuity. In the case of steel, if our leaders weren't protecting us, we could "import" the ingenuity of foreign steel makers.
The benefit of trade is that it allows us to access the distinctive skills of other countries. Why should we use trade policy instead to impose other countries' bad economic policies on ourselves?
It's possible reimportation, if enacted, will never actually occur. Because of safety concerns, the Clinton administration refused to implement a reimportation law passed several years ago, and the Bush administration may do the same.
Nonetheless, many in Congress, not least Minnesota Sen. Paul Wellstone, seem determined to find some way of controlling drug prices or otherwise reducing drug company profits, perhaps by shortening patent life on new drugs. However it's done, shrinking the rewards for discovering new drugs will have a predictable economic effect of discouraging industry investment in those discoveries.
It's possible we'd be better off legislating lower prices on the drugs we already have, and "paying" for those lower prices by seeing industry invent fewer new drugs. In health care generally, there may come a point where it no longer makes sense to keep developing ever more sophisticated treatments we can't afford. But this would be a difficult policy choice, worthy of careful debate. It seems more likely that policy is being driven today by political calculations.
Few Americans buy steel or lumber directly, but only as materials in cars, houses and other products. So higher steel or lumber prices caused by trade barriers are well hidden. Politicians can get away with picking consumers' pockets to enrich protected interests and enjoy the resulting political rewards.
By contrast, consumers, especially seniors, are well aware of the cost of drugs. What they won't see will be the life-saving and life-enhancing drugs that may never be invented if price controls take effect.
That's why encouraging "cheap foreign imports" of drugs is as good for an American politician's health as fighting "cheap foreign imports" of steel.
Write Tice at dtice@pioneerpress.com or at the Pioneer Press, 345 Cedar St., St. Paul, MN 55101.
I doubt it.
Indeed, and if we don't do something about "free" trade, it may cost us our freedom. What would you pay for that "externality"?
You see, when a US corporation flees US regulation (which is the biggest reason they do leave, not the cost of labor) what they are doing is assuming that contracts will be guaranteed and safe transit will be assured. How do they get that? The US military, paid for by US taxpayers. It's a MASSIVE subsidy. What is the risk if those foreign supply lines are interrupted? What is the risk when we export technology? Who has a collective claim on the use of that technology paid for by US taxpayers and perfected by US hourly workers? Was there an implicit contract there?
We are talking real, accountable, actuarial risks here, sonny, not some hokey chimera. It is entirely appropriate for the citizens of a country to freely choose to pay for those risks in the form higher prices for the protection of domestic producers, whether guidance systems for incoming missiles or less apparently technical goods with equally strategic value.
For example, I don't suppose you know that the US is now a net importer of food. 80% of domestic US farm investment is to retire producing fields. Consortia of socialist Slave Party investors, one led by Lloyd Bensten, are buying up land in Mexico and South America to produce food for the US market. Meanwhile the same investors use their tax exempt foundations to fund Envirowack NGOs to control water and runoff "pollution" to put their competition, those US farmers, out of business. That will get them higher prices.
What is the risk of cutting off food? Have communists ever used starvation to coerce or eradicate a population?
It isn't a matter of inherent competitiveness, we are seeing cheaper prices from imported goods in part, because we are willing to accept the cost of risk. Looks a little dicey to me.
Now consider another example of trade subsidy in the assumption of risk, incoming weapons in containers. Containers don't get inspected. Is that a subsidy? How about exotic species or pathogens? Who pays to treat the diseases and eradicate the pests? US medical providers and farmers. Are those "cheaper" prices really worth it? What is West Nile Virus going to cost?
When we use foreign slave labor, aren't we subsidizing slavery? To what degree? You have no idea, do you?
Traditionally, we have used governments to identify unacceptible risks and exercise their power to control borders to apportion them. It is true that in some cases a union for example buys preferential treatment. I would argue that there are actuarial mechanics by which those subsidies could be calculated and apportioned. Until then, we will have to continue to rely upon the judgment of political leaders and hold them accountable.
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