The Conservative - Libertarian Schism: Constitutionalism And Freedom

FreeRepublic ^ | July 15, 2002 | Francis W. Porretto

[x]

The anarchist element has grown in contemporary libertarianism. The idea of creating a free political order or a political system of freedom gets lost in government baiting. While this strand in libertarianism certainly deserves a fair hearing on practical matters, one can't ignore or slight the great achievement of the founders in creating a free nation and a political system that allows for great human freedom.

[Smile-n-Win]

Excellent post.

The United States is indeed in sore need of a Constitutional restoration. If I were President, I would pass an executive order (to fight fire with fire) establishing an agency whose sole job it were to find violations of the Constitution, other than itself, and stop them. FDA? Poof! BATF? Poof! FTC? Poof! NEA? Poof! Payments to the UN? Poof!

Anyone who tried to attack this agency as unconstitutional would find himself in a terrible catch-22...

[AdamSelene235]

one can't ignore or slight the great achievement of the founders in creating a free nation and a political system that allows for great human freedom.

It only took 150 years for Congress to decide that growing corn on you own land, to feed to your own hogs was interstate commerce that must be Federally controlled.

The limited government experiment has failed.

The Republic is dead.

Its time to try something else.

[headsonpikes]

Brilliant piece.

Ping me. ;^)

[AdamSelene235]

Help Elect Democrats......Vote Libertarian!!

Well, its no longer a matter of voting for Socialists or Constitutionalists.

The Republicans will not run a conservative candidate.

Now its just a question of the flavor of Socialism: Do you want the State to subsidize steel or medicine?

Run someone like Keyes and the Libs will vote Republican.

[gcruse]

Help Elect Democrats......Vote Libertarian!!

I'm afraid you're right.  I feel awful about it.
I voted mostly Libertarian and we ended
up with trade tariffs, agriwelfare, and a
concerted effort to deny states' rights.
Woe is I.

[Valin]

One more bump.

The problem with Libertarian and other 3rd parties is they don't appear to be able to win elections. By this I mean water commissioner, county board, school board...etc. Until they show that they can 1 win elections, and 2 govern they are doomed to be debating societies.

[BurFred]

As if Harry Browne would have done so much better. Simple, unarguable fact is that as a conservative when you vote Libertarian you take a vote away from the viable Republican canadate. I don't agree with everything Bush has done, but I voted for him because in order to advance an agenda(an in the case of Bush I will grant you that his current agenda seems at odds with my own)you have to be ELECTABLE!! How much legislation are the elected libertarians in the house and senate advancing for you? How about Harry Browne? Is he getting alot done for you in Washington? Keep voting Libertarian, and keep being on the outside looking in with no representation and no hope for an ELECTABLE candidate in the future.

[headsonpikes]

bump

[gcruse]

As if Harry Browne would have done so much better.

I didn't vote for Browne, I voted for Bush, then libertarian
on this rest of the ticket.   You assume much.

[BurFred]

I ask you again, how much are your Libertarian congressmen and senators getting done for you in Washington? How many Libertarian politicians are elected in your state and local government? I would rather have elected officials that I can call on for change than unelected people I can sit and gripe with. If I am on a sinking ship I want to try and patch the holes rather than jumping overboard and not being able to get anything done.

[gcruse]

My beliefs are libertarian. The fact I voted for Bush is my problem to deal with. If you don't believe in voting your conscience, that's your problem.

[zoyd]

If I am on a sinking ship I want to try and patch the holes rather than jumping overboard and not being able to get anything done.

At the rate Republicans are going, those holes keep appearing, and faster than you can patch them. The ship is sinking... at some point, you're better off in the water than going down with the ship. I wish, in your analogy, that there were enough people trying to patch the holes to make the effort worthwhile, but this baby is taking on water...

[BurFred]

"I wish, in your analogy, that there were enough people trying to patch the holes to make the effort worthwhile"

Which is the very reason not to abandon the Republican party. That Is my biggest problem with most conservatives. It is an all or nothing mentality."If I don't get everything I want I'm taking my toys and going home" There is no way to fix something if you aren't involved in the effort.

[gunshy]

Now let's see. If I vote for a democrat I am going to get a liberal vote in the congress. If I vote for a republican, I am going to get a liberal vote in the congress. If I vote libertarian, I may get a democrat or a republican in the congress and I still get a liberal vote in the congress. I guess the only way for me to change things is to not vote.

[gunshy]

I voted for Bush

Then you admit that you are a liberal.

[BurFred]

"If I vote for a democrat I am going to get a liberal vote in the congress. If I vote for a republican, I am going to get a liberal vote in the congress. If I vote libertarian, I may get a democrat or a republican in the congress and I still get a liberal vote in the congress"

No, if you vote Libertarian you get no vote in the congress since they don't win.

[gcruse]

I voted for Bush

Then you admit that you are a liberal.

What are you talking about?  Any idea?
 
 

[BurFred]

Voting strictly based on your conscience is a bit like masturbation, It feels good temporarily but does nothing to improve your overall love life.

[gcruse]

This thread has turned into cybermasturbation on your part. Anyone whose votes do not reflect their beliefs is not fit to converse with. I am done with you.