Man who sued to stop pledge explains reasons for suit

SF Chronicle via AP ^ | 6/26/02 | STEFANIE FRITH

[I_Love_My_Husband]

Sacramento atheist Michael Newdow said Wednesday he was trying to restore the Pledge of Allegiance to its pre-1954 version because no one should be forced to worship a religion in which they don't believe.

But if the threatening messages on his answering machine are any indication, the American public is not thanking him.

[Utopia]

And, if they don't like it here, they can leave...I am sick and tired of people complaining about what they have to "suffer" in the name of God. If they don't want to say the evil word "God", then they don't have to.

Well said. The thing that irritates me the most is that we've already started a trend of thinking that basically insists: " I have the right not to be offended ... and you're offending me... stop what ever it is you're doing

What's next? Will wearing the Cross or the Star of David as a piece of jewlery be banned because it might offend some God forsaken nihilist? Where does this crap end?

[thrcanbonly1]

Mighty Christian of you.

[uncommonsense]

He said Wednesday's decision is a "hopping off point" for other lawsuits, including one to end family laws, such as those concerning custody.

Here's the crux - overthrow morality. An atheistic anarchist.

[Utopia]

You can't leave your doors unlocked. You can't walk down the streets safely in places that you always could.

The worst of the crime started when the ACLU et al decided that there was no place for God in the country. When people take offence at the 10 commandments being present and therefore don't feel obligated to heed them. Its all the fault of the nihilists.

[twntaipan]

Thanks!

[rwfromkansas]

It was FEDERAL funds......

[rwfromkansas]

Congressionally appropriated......

[sarasmom]

"Do you think while he's at it, he'll go for a lawsuit that takes God out of all those insurance policies ... as in, not responsible for loss by acts of God?"

LOL!

reminds me of an old saying-"No atheists allowed in foxholes"

I wonder what people like this do when only a miracle will save their loved one, or who they curse when the miracle does not happen? Do they just say oh well..that's life?

[speekinout]

Just thought I'd point out here that not ALL atheists are America-hating, law-suit filing weirdos. Some might even be *gasp* conservatives.

OK. I can believe that. And would those atheists accept the fact that our founding fathers were mostly Christian? And that their christianity had a lot to do with how they framed our Constitution and form of gov't?

[twntaipan]

You might want to assist the other fundamentalist atheists--it seems that there is religious speech found in the Preamble to the Constitution.

The Constitution of the United States of America

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

[Chewbacca]

This court decision was based on the supposed "separation of church and state".
I think the judge needs have a remedial class on Interpretation of the Constitution.
I can't seem to find the words separation of church and state in the constituion.

[Arizflash]

Where the heck do you live? Best leave that neighborhood.

[Utopia]

Non sequitur. So far nobody ahs been discussing anythign resembling someone going to court to curtail anybody's liberties. The only thing being discussed is whether the government has the right to preach religion at students.
I disagree. We're talking about GOD not religion. There is a difference.

If you don't like 'em preaching Islam at the kiddies, then you know what your answer should be.
They do teach Islam in some CA schools and many parents don't have a choice in the matter

And if you beleive that "Under God" is *not* a religious expression, then it becomes meaningless, and you won't mind it being removed from the pledge.
Non Sequitor. It is not a religious expression, and I like the pledge just the way it is. Your sillogism is faulty.

In fact, if you are a Christian, you will probably WANT it removed from the pledge.
Incorrect conclusion. I'm not a Christian (stated so many times before.) I've recited the pledge many, many times. It never offended me.

Do you want your religious beliefs being turned meaningless and force fed to people?
I don't impose my beliefs on anyone. But a belief in a Creator is the basic philosophy of the founding of this country. The pledge acknowledges this. Therefore, the word GOD stays. Its only offensive to the nihilists.

[DJ88]

"Because reasonable people prevailed."

I have been reading your posts, and I have a hard time with your arguments. So...it's okay for this "father" to subject his child to what will amount to be a most untasteful return to school? For what reason? He did it for her? BS. He did it for himself. Any parent in their right mind would never subject their child to what this little girl will be subjected to for what will seem to be to her an eternity. Children are strong, yes; but this little girl is at a pivotal stage in her life...trying to make friends, etc. What good has her father done for her? There could have been a simpler way to handle this "oh so horrible mention of God", like telling her to stick her fingers in her ears. What is she going to do for the rest of her life when she hears that dreaded word "GOD"? Have Daddy file a LAWSUIT? Give me a break! They need love, care and above all else, a parent who has his/her children's best interests at heart. As the mother of a 2nd grader, I find it very difficult to believe that his daughter hearing the Pledge of Allegience with the words "Under God" is going to scar her. Her father has taken care of that, hasn't he?

What an ass he is.

[rwfromkansas]

Sir, please explain away as false the following, if you please:

1. Jefferson, a guy who wrote about a "wall of separation of church and state," attended church in the Congressional building 3 days after writing that phrase.
2. Jefferson gave federal money to missionaries.
3. Madison, the father of the Bill of Rights, supported, alongside with Jefferson, a bill to "punish Sabbathbreakers" while in the Virginia Legislature. Keep in mind these were two of the most liberal founding fathers.
4. The U.S. Supreme Court, which ruled the public display of the Ten Commandments is wrong, has a statue of Moses and the Commandments in its chambers.
5. It was not until the 1940's when the current radical view of the separation of church and state came about. In fact, previous rulings of the U.S. Supreme Court, as well as state supreme courts, ruled in favor of things as far as blue laws mandating the closing of stores on Sundays.
6. The Northwest Ordinance, which was needed to become a new territory since I think 1787, required that schools support religion and morality.

[Clemenza]

Funny, I had to hear things in school I didn't believe in. Come to think of it, I was made to DO things I didn't believe in. Is school itself unconstitutional?

YOU'VE GOT IT!!!

--- Clemenza, who was forced to do square dancing (in NEW YORK!), among other pointless activities, at his government school.

[pyx]

Sacramento atheist Michael Newdow

Atheist Micheal Newdow has deprived millions of Americans of their Constitutionally guaranteed RIGHTS. (ie. First Amendment ... "religion or the free exercise thereof."

I have three words for Michael Newdow, Ambulance chaser;

Class Action Lawsuit.

[rwfromkansas]

I will add this as well....please explain all these away for me to take you seriously:

1. Jefferson, a guy who wrote about a "wall of separation of church and state," attended church in the Congressional building 3 days after writing that phrase.
2. Jefferson gave federal money to missionaries.
3. Madison, the father of the Bill of Rights, supported, alongside with Jefferson, a bill to "punish Sabbathbreakers" while in the Virginia Legislature. Keep in mind these were two of the most liberal founding fathers.
4. The U.S. Supreme Court, which ruled the public display of the Ten Commandments is wrong, has a statue of Moses and the Commandments in its chambers.
5. It was not until the 1940's when the current radical view of the separation of church and state came about. In fact, previous rulings of the U.S. Supreme Court, as well as state supreme courts, ruled in favor of things as far as blue laws mandating the closing of stores on Sundays.
6. The Northwest Ordinance, which was needed to become a new territory since I think 1787, required that schools support religion and morality.

[Clemenza]

Just thought I'd point out here that not ALL atheists are America-hating, law-suit filing weirdos. Some might even be *gasp* conservatives.

Good point. My friend is the most conservative man in South Florida and is an Atheist.